"Stoopid" handcuffs donated to the Smithsonian

[mak2]

you're spot on..

I also have a feeling they treated this guy with kid gloves from the begining.

Having worn a badge and a gun, I can tell you I would have givin him 1 warning about disorderly/disturbing the peace- after that he would have been hooked up

By the way you could not arrest me for the exact same thing here before 10pm.

 

[jimbo]

I had a similar incident happen when I accidently dialed 911 instead of 910. Even though I immediately terminated the call, a cop showed up on the doorstep. My wife called me down from my office, and I explained. Even then, the cop asked if he could look around, and did. Nothing out of the ordinary was found, and the cop went on his way, after my thanking him for looking out for my property and my wife.
It seems to me that we would not be discussing this situation if the professor had acted similarly. The cop was not there to harass a black, but to investigate a B & E.
The situation escalated out of control when the professor would not give it up.

The second escalation started when BO stated on TV that even he did not know what happened, he was sure that the cop behaved stupidly. IMO this was a statement that could be based only on one premise. The correct answer to the BO question should have been:

"I do not know what went on, but even though Skip Gates is a friend of mine, I have no opinion. In any event, this is a local matter and not in my jurisdiction."

 

[mak2]

He was in his home. He did not have to give it up.

 

[jimbo]

Mak, if you are going to respond to my posts, and I hope that you do, please do me 2 favors. Don't take three words out of context for your response, and second, do a little research on the matter. According to the police report, which is available on the internet, and as far as I know, has not been disputed, Gates was not inside the home, but had followed the policemen (there were 2) outside to continue the argument. Gates was arrested after repeated warnings to "cool" it, and in the end he insisted he be arrested and directed to the cops chief. At the time of the arrest, there were at least 7 resident witnesses, and several Harvard Cops, who had been summoned after Gates pulled the influence card. None of the witnesses have the disputed the report of the incident. The cop went so far as to summons a Harvard maintenance man to secure the building after Gates left the door wide open and stated that it could not be locked after a recent breakin.

The report is 3 pages long and readily available. I'll not bother to cite it.

Bottom line: The incident escalated only after Gates became uncooperative.
Secondly the statement by POTUS that even though he didn't have the facts, he knew the problem and that the cops behaved stupidly, clearly was based on only one supposition, the same one that Gates was making.

 

[mak2]

I added the police report, you might read it. The police officer told Gates he would talk to him outside. Gates followed him outside where he was arrested. See post 33. You read it.

 

[mak2]

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2009/0723092gates2.html

This is a copy of the police report in the polices words. I thought at the time at least the PD and the police officer were honest. At worst the police officer directed the man to go outside yelling, there by causing Gates to commit the offense.

this is the same fourm that thinks a guy intentionally inciting border gaurds to arrest him is a hero, I dont get it.

Just so it wont be too hard to find.

 

[EastTexFrank]

Bulldog1401, I think you answered the question and explained the situation very well.

I can't understand the hang-up about being "in his home" when he clearly wasn't, he was on his porch or in his yard. He may have still been on his property but that is not the same as being "in" his home.

You can't walk around naked in your front yard. You can't walk around naked on your front porch. You can however walk around naked in your own home as long as you don't stand in front of or be observed by passersby through the window. Your home might be your castle but that does not give you a right to commit a public nuisance or disturbance within it's walls.

I don't know why we are even discussing this. The guy is a prick and the news paper article quoted in one of the posts called it exactly right.

 

[jimbo]

I did read the report, and your post 33. But thanks for proving my point.

 

[mak2]

So the guy is a prick and he deserves to be arrested. It aint public in your home. Your closed mindedness amazes me. Think aobut he difference in takes on Professor Gates adn this guy. http://www.forumsforums.com/3_9/showthread.php?t=32447&highlight=hero+preacher

 

[JEV]

mac2, you are just hellbent on crucifying the cop, regardless of the facts, and siding with a grown man acting like a punk, street hood. Amazing. If one of your children or an emploee acted this way towards YOU, how much of that malarkey would you tolerate?

 

[mak2]

Jev the entire time I have talked about our rights as citizens. The only thing I said about the police officer's character was about his and his departments honesty. He admitted to telling Gates he would talk to him outside, where the officer arrested him. You do and should have rights in you own home and property. Perhaps you could be arrested were he is at for yelling or being loud anytime of day, but the officer should have been a professional and left instead of lureing him outside. You guys cannot see that because the person in question was a buddy of Obama's. Him being a prick or a jerk or a racist makes absolutely no difference when it comes to his rights. While some silly white guy intentionally pissing off border guards on the road is a hero on this very same fourm. Just what I have been trying to point out about the complete unwillingness to discuss an issue, just drown out the opposition. i dont care, I am jsut trying to get you guys to think and at the same time I get to think through my issues. Sometimes I learn something. You (the collective) dont have that advantage, you already know everything.

 

[jimbo]

My last post on this thread. The officer did not "lure" Gates outside his home. Gates followed him when he was trying to leave. No one grabbed him by collar and dragged him outside to be arrested. You do have property rights on your property and inside your home, but the expectation or privacy ends if it can be seen or heard outside the property. Clearly this was the case. Gates was warned, and insisted he be arrested.

Next: What the hell does a silly white guy intentionally pissing off border guards on the road have to do with a Harvard proffessor in Boston? If you what to discuss that issue, start a thread, and I will research it and maybe respond. Might be interesting.
If we are not willing to discuss an issue, why, then do we have 4 pages of comments?

 

[mak2]

On this forum one is a hero and one a villian.

Thanks for enlightening me.

 

[JEV]

Jev the entire time I have talked about our rights as citizens. The only thing I said about the police officer's character was about his and his departments honesty. He admitted to telling Gates he would talk to him outside, where the officer arrested him. You do and should have rights in you own home and property. Perhaps you could be arrested were he is at for yelling or being loud anytime of day, but the officer should have been a professional and left instead of lureing him outside. You guys cannot see that because the person in question was a buddy of Obama's. Him being a prick or a jerk or a racist makes absolutely no difference when it comes to his rights. While some silly white guy intentionally pissing off border guards on the road is a hero on this very same fourm. Just what I have been trying to point out about the complete unwillingness to discuss an issue, just drown out the opposition. i dont care, I am jsut trying to get you guys to think and at the same time I get to think through my issues. Sometimes I learn something. You (the collective) dont have that advantage, you already know everything.

I realize you have stuck on that point, but have avoided the common sense/common courtesy aspect, which is what got the professor in trouble in the first place. I fully understand that legal rights may have been in question, but the fact that a person used his influence to abuse someone who was there to provide protection during an alleged B&E question, is being ignored and even celebrated. I see so much of this verbal abuse of authority because people are "within their rights" to say what they want to anyone, at the expense of common courtesy. We've become a society of abusers, and our bad manners are on display to the entire world. I guess I must be old fashioned, because I actually taught my children to respect authority and to cooperate with them as long as they do not feel threatened or intimidated. I never took the time to teach them what their legal rights were so they could push the line whenever they chose to do so. I'm very pleased at how they turned out, and my eldest's best friend is a female police detective who is sickened by the abuse she has to take from the inner city black youth, who know their rights much better than they know their manners. She says she mostly gets cooperation and respect from white criminals.

 

[SShepherd]

By the way you could not arrest me for the exact same thing here before 10pm.

you have no disturbing the peace ord. where you live?

BTW..he also could have been arrested for interfering with a police investigation. Remember, you can still spend the night in jail untill you get to court- regardless of innocence. thats why it's always best to be polite

 

[mak2]

you have no disturbing the peace ord. where you live?

BTW..he also could have been arrested for interfering with a police investigation. Remember, you can still spend the night in jail untill you get to court- regardless of innocence. thats why it's always best to be polite

I can make all the noise I want to before 10p and after 6am. Dogs can bark, I can have crazy parties. etc.

 

[mak2]

I realize you have stuck on that point, but have avoided the common sense/common courtesy aspect, which is what got the professor in trouble in the first place. I fully understand that legal rights may have been in question, but the fact that a person used his influence to abuse someone who was there to provide protection during an alleged B&E question, is being ignored and even celebrated. I see so much of this verbal abuse of authority because people are "within their rights" to say what they want to anyone, at the expense of common courtesy. We've become a society of abusers, and our bad manners are on display to the entire world. I guess I must be old fashioned, because I actually taught my children to respect authority and to cooperate with them as long as they do not feel threatened or intimidated. I never took the time to teach them what their legal rights were so they could push the line whenever they chose to do so. I'm very pleased at how they turned out, and my eldest's best friend is a female police detective who is sickened by the abuse she has to take from the inner city black youth, who know their rights much better than they know their manners. She says she mostly gets cooperation and respect from white criminals.

You are not old fashioned in that regard. I remember when I was in high school they had to have a search warrent to check my locker. At the time one of the arguments against allowing the locker to be searched at will would just desenstize people about search and seizure and personal rights. From the attiudes that and the war on drugs have worked. You guys really seem to think the police can do anything they want to. Guess we really dont desrerve those rights anyway. Maybe your last line really explains what we have been arguing about this whole time. That is why I included the part about the preacher. He was a white guy acting a fool with authority on the streets and he is a hero. A professor in his home is a villan. I just find that interesting.

 

[RedRocker]

He's not a villain, he's an insolent dumb ass. The cop was investigating a B&E, this isn't rocket science. Prove identity, explain the circumstances, everybody goes home happy.
Play the race card, chew on the cops ass, get in the cops face, act like a douche bag and go to jail. Nobody's rights were trampled, nobody is desensitized. Now if the cop was walking down the street, saw a black guy in the house and proceeded to check it out, you'd have a valid point, but that ain't the way it went down. Damn it's hard to talk common sense to liberals.

 

[JEV]

He's not a villain, he's an insolent dumb ass. The cop was investigating a B&E, this isn't rocket science. Prove identity, explain the circumstances, everybody goes home happy.
Play the race card, chew on the cops ass, get in the cops face, act like a douche bag and go to jail. Nobody's rights were trampled, nobody is desensitized. Now if the cop was walking down the street, saw a black guy in the house and proceeded to check it out, you'd have a valid point, but that ain't the way it went down. Damn it's hard to talk common sense to liberals.

AMEN, brother. I was beginning to think I was lacking articulation while conveying my point. It's just that Mak won't let the race card and the bad cop thing go. If it were a white professor acting in the same manner, his ass would have been locked up as well. Christians who try to live their lives according to God's will, subject themselves to authority. In Romans 13:1 it says "Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God." Knowing that man will sometime abuse the privileged of serving God as his representative, Christians have comfort in knowing that it says in Daniel 2:21 that God is still in control. "It is He who changes the times and the epochs; He removes kings and establishes kings; He gives wisdom to wise men And knowledge to men of understanding." So, while Barry and Harry and Botox Nancy and their ilk continue to abuse the privileged of service, I'm comfortable knowing that God is going to win in the end...He always does! anyone remember the flood thingy? Ever seen a locust?

 

[Glink]

Not long ago on this very forum there was some guy portrayed as a hero becasue he was harrassing border guards into arresting him. Hummm.

Yea, but. I am real big on personal rights.

Think aobut he difference in takes on Professor Gates adn this guy. http://www.forumsforums.com/3_9/show...=hero+preacher

Jev the entire time I have talked about our rights as citizens.

I am sorry Mak but I just don't get it. These statements and references just don't square. You state your concern for individual rights as your basis for criticizing the cops arresting of Mr. Gates; and then turn right around and say that you can't understand some folk's, on this forum, support of the preacher in the other reference.

That preacher was protesting the supposed existence of a "Constitution Free Zone" inside the geographic boundaries of this country. WTF? How can you, a repeated advocate of individual rights in the Gates incident, not understand how folks on this forum might support this man in his protest of a "Constitution Free Zone”?

Now I realize that I am just a stupid knuckle dragging conservative. But perhaps you would be so kind as to enlighten me, and relieve my confusion in this apparent hypocrisy.

 

[mak2]

AMEN, brother. I was beginning to think I was lacking articulation while conveying my point. It's just that Mak won't let the race card and the bad cop thing go.

I really dont think the cops are bad and I really dont think I have said that. I dont know wethere the arrest was legal. I do know in the bigger picture it is not right. I and you should be able to act like an ass on your own property if you want to. But you guys aint even arguing that> you guys argue that Gates should ahve been arrested because he played the race card and acted out, without theatening anything or anyone. I truly hope you dont really believe playing the race card should even be a contributing factor to his arrest.

 

[mak2]

[/B][/B][/FONT]

He's not a villain, he's an insolent dumb assI agree. The cop was investigating a B&E, this isn't rocket sciencecorrect . Prove identityhe did, explain the circumstances, everybody goes home happy the cop should have left.
Play the race card, chew on the cops ass, get in the cops face, act like a douche bag and go to jailwhy. Nobody's rights were trampled, nobody is desensitized. Now if the cop was walking down the street, saw a black guy in the house and proceeded to check it out, you'd have a valid point, but that ain't the way it went down. Damn it's hard to talk common sense to liberals.

Thank God someone does not understand your "common sense".

 

[brazospete]

Boy I'm fixin to stick my red dirt foot in my mouth again! I can feel it comin.

 

[pirate_girl]

I truly hope you dont really believe playing the race card should even be a contributing factor to his arrest.

I think it was Mak.
He played the card like a fiddle.
Look back on one of his earlier statements--

“This is what happens to black men in
America. You don’t know who you’re messing with.”

He should be thankful that affirmative action shined down upon him and that he accomplished what he did as a Harvard professor.
He can now dodge the race card and consider himself in the front of the bus, can't he?

 

[brazospete]

I lived thru the civil rights movement! I was intigrated ! I was There! It was !961 and I was 11! Things were different before that but I was too young to notice much or had much of a chance to notice much. It was segregated before and I guess a lot of bad stuff got done but I never saw any of it. I was blissfully unaware. I graduated Bonham elementary in spring 61 and entered Lincoln jr. High in the fall In Abilene Texas. On the first day of my seventh grade I climbed up the four steps at the front Doors and turned around and looked into a sea of black faces all looking at ME! I turned around and hurried thru the door!

 

[pirate_girl]

Pedro, you crack me up.

 

[JEV]

I think it was Mak.
He played the card like a fiddle.
Look back on one of his earlier statements--

“This is what happens to black men in
America. You don’t know who you’re messing with.”

He should be thankful that affirmative action shined down upon him and that he accomplished what he did as a Harvard professor.
He can now dodge the race card and consider himself in the front of the bus, can't he?

Thank you, PG. Mak is standing firm on his belief in spite of the facts.

Ya know, these libs are going to cause their own downfall (which is in process as we speak) because they are so entrenched in their own belief system of how "things should be," that they completely look past the facts like you presented here, as if they did not exist. Like the Muslim post, I'm not sure if it's because they have

or they have

I can't say which it is, but neither is going to benefit them in their arguments where there are black & white facts on the table.

 

[RedRocker]

[/B][/B][/FONT]

Thank God someone does not understand your "common sense".

I'm afraid people that lack common sense wouldn't recognize it, so
no problem.