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Kurt Vonnegut

Obdurate

Obdurate

New member
R.I.P. You Legend
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"A classy way to commit suicide."


Kurt Vonnegut, Jr., ( /ˈvɒnɪɡət/; November 11, 1922 – April 11, 2007) was one of the most influential American writers of the 20th century. He wrote such works as Mother Night (1961), Slaughterhouse-Five (1969), and Breakfast of Champions (1973) blending satire, black comedy, and science fiction. He was known for his humanist beliefs and was honorary president of the American Humanist Association.[2]
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He's been my favourite author for a while, and even though he died a few years ago now, I'm still feeling the loss. He was a modern day Mark Twain, though he would have disagreed with that because he looked up to Twain so much.
 
Melensdad said:
One of his best works is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrison_Bergeron

Which was made into the short movie YouTube - 2081 Full Movie | Based on Kurt Vonnegut's "Harrison Bergeron" (1080p HD)
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Ooooh, I didn't know there was a short film. I'm going to check that out later.

CityGirl said:
What is your favorite Vonnegut book?
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Hmm. It's hard because I like a lot of them equally, and they kind of blend together for me into one big ball of awesome. However, I'm going to say probably Cat's Cradle and Breakfast of Champions. Followed by Mother Night, Player Piano and The Sirens of Titan. There are still a few books of his that I have to read, so this list may change.

I always liked seeing his assessment of his own work, not in terms of where he stands in literary history, but his own writing... this doesn't cover all of his works though:
Player Piano: B
The Sirens of Titan: A
Mother Night: A
Cat's Cradle: A-plus
God Bless You, Mr. Rosewater: A
Slaughterhouse-Five: A-plus
Welcome to the Monkey House: B-minus
Happy Birthday, Wanda June: D
Breakfast of Champions: C
Slapstick: D
Jailbird: A
Palm Sunday: C

So I'm at odds with him big time on Breakfast of Champions. I don't know if it's just because it was the second book of his I read (the first is Slapstick, which I really like too), or if it was because of near the end (there's a part I felt was really emotional). I think it's a lot of fun and while it isn't as "important" as some of his other works, I love it.

Slaughterhouse-Five is always the book I give to introduce him to people, simply because that seems to be what schools do, and since Vonnegut loved it himself. I think it's one of the more interesting ones, conceptually, but in terms of writing, it doesn't grab me quite as much as his others. Like I said though, I'm a Vonnegut nuthugger, and I admit this.

Have you read anything by him?
 
loboloco said:
Vonnegut was an ok, but not great writer. I wish he had lasted a few years longer myself.
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I've read Cat's Cradle, and of course Slaughterhouse-Five, and quite enjoyed them, though it's been a long time ago.

Speaking of authors we'd wish had lasted longer-
Raymond Carver.. great author of short stories.
Cathedral and Where I'm Calling From.. excellent!
 
Obdurate said:
I disagree, but I think I know why you say that. Maybe instead of assuming, why do you think that?
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Well.Vonnegut's writing style was stiff, and sometimes hard to follow. He wrote to demagogue, not to entertain. As I said, a good, but not great writer. After having read several 10's of thousands of books I would rate him as slightly better than average.
 
Yeah, that's what I thought you meant but I still disagree. I think the reasons you think he's slightly above average are the reasons I think he's fantastic. I enjoy the conversational tone of his writing (I don't get the 'stiff' criticism because it's always been pretty fluid and natural to me), and how he can say a lot with simple words. It's not exactly James Joyce level wordplay, but it doesn't intend to be. I tend to judge any art form based on what it set out to do, and if it accomplishes that, more than if I'm entertained. I think Vonnegut perfectly captures what he wants to do.

But take this with a grain of salt, because I also don't like grammar Nazis, and would rather destroy the English language than embrace all the petty little rules. Not saying that Vonnegut has bad grammar, I'm just explaining where I'm coming from. I write really roughly, with a blatant disregard for normal rules a lot of the time. I'd hate to be an editor editing my shit because it would drive them up the wall haha.
 
won't argue Ob, but you have to remember, a fiction writer's first objective is to entertain. If he can't do that, irregardless of his prose or his message, he is not a good writer.
 
I'd love to enter into this discussion but unfortunately it's been so long since I've read any of his stuff, I don't think that I have anything constructive to add. So, tomorrow I'm heading for the local public library and start a little research. I'll get back to you all. :neutral:
 
loboloco said:
won't argue Ob, but you have to remember, a fiction writer's first objective is to entertain. If he can't do that, irregardless of his prose or his message, he is not a good writer.
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A writer's objective is whatever he/she wants, and entertainment doesn't necessarily equal good quality of writing. I'm not saying it's going to get a writer far if he/she doesn't entertain, but an artist doesn't have an objective, aside from making art how he/she wants to. Anything else is dishonest. If you want to entertain, great. If you want to deconstruct literature (or any art), that's great too. Most choose to entertain, and that's fair, because you want to have a fanbase.

But I guess really, my question is: what entertains? I'm entertained by more straight forward fiction but I'd also read a book that's so avant-garde it's almost unreadable. Why would that entertain me? Because artist intent interests me greatly. Why did he/she do that?

To bring it back... Vonnegut is hugely entertaining. :tongue: Whereas a book like Infinite Jest didn't entertain me at all, and I won't deny that David Foster Wallace is an extremely talented writer.
 
Every writer's goals are as follows:

1. Pay the rent
2. Whatever will accomplish goal #1

However, if a writer of fiction doesn't entertain, he/she will fail at #1 and be basically unknown. So, Vonnegut did entertain the majority of his readers or we wouldn't be having this discussion, would we?? :brows:

 
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