Fur Coats?

[fogtender]

Please mention two examples of where we wipe out a habitat to make a fake fur.

I can't wait...

Well that was Sarcasum, based on the view from the other side, but to make my point I will play the Devil's advicate.

First: Petrochemicals are what most synthetics are made from, which is oil. Any of the Enviorwaco's will say that drilling for oil is distroying our enviorment (which it isn't) but that is their claim, so I will use that one... One only has to look here in Alaska at ANWR and see that oil is a bad name, because it is a "Wilderness" and can't be touched... That is a bunch of crap, but that is what they feed you guys in the Lower 48 states. The oil fields in Alaska are regulated so badly that if you spill a drop of oil, it could cost you your job. Anyway oil has had a bad name from the past which is not the present but they still beat that dead horse.... They claim Birds can't nest, Caribou can't have calves, wolves can't stalk the calves and other bunk...

Second: Cotton, peanuts, corn and other crops to farm where all the natural "Old Growth" had to be wiped out so they could be planted to make synthetic products that are made from those crops chemicals as well as food... Snakes and frogs can't live without the old Growth to hide in...

Third: Mining, hundreds of thousands of acres have been stripped mined to bring you the metals and chemicals to make a colored plastic zipper for your new Hitech coat zipper... Now the fuzzy rabbits have no place to hide and breed....

Fourth: Rubber trees are planted where jungle used to be, for the rubber and other products that are made from them... Again, the forest is stripped clean to plant the trees and so forth...

Fifth: You should get the point by now.

For every action there is an equal reaction, which is not paid attention to by the "Anti" crowds on either side of the isle.... They say cattle are "Farting" too much and distroying the air... well duh... the Buffalo were doing the same thing in as great of numbers until they got replaced by cows... Every issue has two sides and somewhere in the middle lies the common sense area that eludes most people.... (Dem's mostly... had to get that in there...)

Like I said, a lot of people don't look past their nose. The statement that I think you said it was "Acceptable" to go out and trap your fur, verses a fur from a farm is "bad", is equally nuts. Fur is good...period.

Jerks see someone in a fur, then assume that that person is "Rich" and a snob. That is equal to looking at someone with a synthetic jacket and saying that A$$ has distroyed an entire eco system to wear that....

The point is, get a life and live it... Fur is natural and warm and degrades back into the eco system when it is used up (or converted into neat teddy bears), where a synthetic jacket will be out of style in a couple of years and take centuries to decompose and fill already overfull dumps... Think of that!

 

[Melensdad]

. . . where a synthetic jacket will be out of style in a couple of years and take centuries to decompose and fill already overfull dumps.

Fake furs are out of style as soon as they are made, they are not comfortable to the touch, they require extra bulk in the form of insulating material because they don't provide warmth, the require wind blocking materials because they are not wind resistant like natural hide, and they simple don't look or feel good. Basically they are bad copies of the real thing, sort of like those VW "kit cars" that allow you to build a Ferrari or a Rolls Royce out of a VW Beetle by swapping out the body parts. . . they are still just bad copies.

 

[dzalphakilo]

Well that was Sarcasum, based on the view from the other side, but to make my point I will play the Devil's advicate.

First: Petrochemicals are what most synthetics are made from, which is oil. Any of the Enviorwaco's will say that drilling for oil is distroying our enviorment (which it isn't) but that is their claim, so I will use that one... One only has to look here in Alaska at ANWR and see that oil is a bad name, because it is a "Wilderness" and can't be touched... That is a bunch of crap, but that is what they feed you guys in the Lower 48 states. The oil fields in Alaska are regulated so badly that if you spill a drop of oil, it could cost you your job. Anyway oil has had a bad name from the past which is not the present but they still beat that dead horse.... They claim Birds can't nest, Caribou can't have calves, wolves can't stalk the calves and other bunk...

Second: Cotton, peanuts, corn and other crops to farm where all the natural "Old Growth" had to be wiped out so they could be planted to make synthetic products that are made from those crops chemicals as well as food... Snakes and frogs can't live without the old Growth to hide in...

Third: Mining, hundreds of thousands of acres have been stripped mined to bring you the metals and chemicals to make a colored plastic zipper for your new Hitech coat zipper... Now the fuzzy rabbits have no place to hide and breed....

Fourth: Rubber trees are planted where jungle used to be, for the rubber and other products that are made from them... Again, the forest is stripped clean to plant the trees and so forth...

Fifth: You should get the point by now.

For every action there is an equal reaction, which is not paid attention to by the "Anti" crowds on either side of the isle.... They say cattle are "Farting" too much and distroying the air... well duh... the Buffalo were doing the same thing in as great of numbers until they got replaced by cows... Every issue has two sides and somewhere in the middle lies the common sense area that eludes most people.... (Dem's mostly... had to get that in there...)

Like I said, a lot of people don't look past their nose. The statement that I think you said it was "Acceptable" to go out and trap your fur, verses a fur from a farm is "bad", is equally nuts. Fur is good...period.

Jerks see someone in a fur, then assume that that person is "Rich" and a snob. That is equal to looking at someone with a synthetic jacket and saying that A$$ has distroyed an entire eco system to wear that....

The point is, get a life and live it... Fur is natural and warm and degrades back into the eco system when it is used up (or converted into neat teddy bears), where a synthetic jacket will be out of style in a couple of years and take centuries to decompose and fill already overfull dumps... Think of that!

Are you saying the primary purpose for oil in Alaska is for fake fur?

Interesting, no speciffic information on area or manufacturer, just generals.

No crap sherlock, for every action there is a reaction. Eco systems are in trouble all over the world, fake fur is the least of our problems.

What's acceptable to me is the reason why the animals are being killed and how they are killed, plain and simple.

As for snobs wearing fur, only a general observation. Take ten women in Alaska and take ten women in Chicago who wear fur coats. I'll bet you anything if we compare their lifestyles and views on life in general, you may come to the same conclusion I do

Bob, apologies, I didn't see where you answered my question about your wife being in a soriety. Was she?

Interesting that the mentally handicaped issue came up per PB's comment. Made me think of another observation of mine. When in college, I dontated time for the mid state litteracy council. This organization helped those adults who had mental "difficulties", but not serious enough to warrent placing them in a home. Our job was to go out in "the real world" with these people and help them with basic math skills, numbers used in life (such as street and apt numbers) and other things that are needed to "survive" on your own (something a lot of us take for granted).

Bear with me, I'm getting to the point

Well, I was with this organization working "on my own" and it happened a soriety was doing work there as well. Five of the girls, while working in the office with these people had a hard time "adjusting" to working with metally "challanged" people. Got so bad that one girl said she couldn't handle how some of "these people" lived. All these girls were your basic hot sority chicks that had mommy and daddy paying their way through college, and overal had a great lifestyle. Got to the point where I asked three of them why they were doing this job (not getting paid for it)if they hated it so much. The response from all of them was that they were doing it as a requirement for the soreity and that at the end of the year they would get their picture in the paper and make their soreirty look good. You want to guess how many had a fur coat bought by mommy and daddy?

Just things in my life that helped me form my opinions.

Oh by the way fogtender, I used to work at an "outdoors" store. Believe me, I understand where you're coming from on the "geek" side of people and thier "high tech" outdoor equipment. My last day at the store was when I got into an argument with a guy who wanted to buy a "zipper compass". Bottom line, they look cool and they may tell you where north is, but they are absolutely worthless by themselves. I decided to ask him how he intended to use this "zipper compass" by itself (wrong on my end I know). I guess I just got sick of all the people who were inside a "outdoors" store on a beautiful day and bought stuff just to look cool. Won't go into all the guys and gals who wanted to buy high end leather boots for a LONG hike the following week (there is this thing called a "break in period" for stiff leather boots). Also worked with a couple of different guide services in my "younger years". Loved all those people who had the equipment for one trip but didn't know how to use it.

Guess another point would be I have a life and I do live it. Probably lived more in 20 years than most do in a lifetime. Why would you mention "point is get a life and live it"? Like yourself, I now have time to waste on the computer.

PS the tri delts "club" is spelled horrbily wrong, I know, apologies.

 

[dzalphakilo]

Fake furs are out of style as soon as they are made

I know those eskimo chicks care about their style

 

[Troy]

I'm against fur coats for a number of reasons. 1) being there's no point in Females wearing fur coats, All it is designed to do is show her wealth. Who gives a crap!? Coats at wal-mart can look just as expensive as fur coats

Beside I live in Las Vegas, Very seldom do I see Females wearing fur coats

 

[JimR]

I'm against women wearing fur coats for a number of reasons.
Beside I live in Las Vegas, Very seldom do I see Females wearing fur coats

In Vegas they wear their fur coats between their legs, not on their shoulders.


Sorry, I couldn't help myself on that one.

 

[fogtender]

Are you saying the primary purpose for oil in Alaska is for fake fur?

Interesting, no speciffic information on area or manufacturer, just generals.

The response was generic in that you asked what systems were affected, you didn't ask where, time and date.

The remark that "Rich" has become generic for use of furs shows people's stupidity, in fact there are parts of the world that it is still a basic clothing source. That remark shows ingnorace and lack of ability of someone to grasp what/where they come from. Fur farms are a small source of supply, but get the most negitive press and the rest is blanketed with that issue. It would take a libary of books of what eco systems was taken out for suppling each product that man uses in his world, it is a balance we live with.

Fur itself is a basic from of consumption that is replenishable, naturally. It degrades just like we do when we pass on.

My point that we wipe out eco systems in an effort to replace what is supplied naturally is how short sighted we are. We wipe out a forest to plant crops, which is fine with me, but that was a specfic eco system that is gone reguardless. It will grow back someday, but the critters that use to live there, no longer do, they have died off or moved.

 

[dzalphakilo]

The response was generic in that you asked what systems were affected, you didn't ask where, time and date.

The remark that "Rich" has become generic for use of furs shows people's stupidity, in fact there are parts of the world that it is still a basic clothing source. That remark shows ingnorace and lack of ability of someone to grasp what/where they come from. Fur farms are a small source of supply, but get the most negitive press and the rest is blanketed with that issue. It would take a libary of books of what eco systems was taken out for suppling each product that man uses in his world, it is a balance we live with.

Fur itself is a basic from of consumption that is replenishable, naturally. It degrades just like we do when we pass on.

My point that we wipe out eco systems in an effort to replace what is supplied naturally is how short sighted we are. We wipe out a forest to plant crops, which is fine with me, but that was a specfic eco system that is gone reguardless. It will grow back someday, but the critters that use to live there, no longer do, they have died off or moved.

Ok, I'm asking for a time, date and manufacturing facility.

Have any statistics on people in the U.S that own fur clothing? I'd be willing to bet that the majority that own fur do not collect food stamps.

We do agree 100% on the fact that we tend to be very short sighted.

 

[JimR]

Ok, I'm asking for a time, date and manufacturing facility.

Have any statistics on people in the U.S that own fur clothing? I'd be willing to bet that the majority that own fur do not collect food stamps.

We do agree 100% on the fact that we tend to be very short sighted.

My wife has a nice rabbit coat. We are not on food stamps and we are not rich. Of course a rabbit coat is cheap compared to a Mink coat. I really don't consider her rabbit coat a fur coat because they do cost so little.

 

[Cityboy]

We just got back from a shopping trip to Chicago and one of the things the lovely Mrs_B got on this trip was a new casual fur coat. While in the fur vault......

Just curious, BS....how much did you pay for this fur that has created so much debate?

And what kind of critter did the fur come from?

Must have been a pretty valuable fur to be kept in a vault?

 

[Bobcat]

Leaping lizards! They just found the Skurka vault!!

Furs found after 30 years in storage

Thu Dec 27, 5:56 PM ET

BELLOWS FALLS, Vt. - Sam Haskins didn't ask for a fur coat for Christmas. But he got six of them.

Haskins, the new owner of a hardware store, made an unexpected discovery early this month when he started poking around the basement: a climate-controlled vault containing six fur coats, about a dozen suits and some dresses and hats, apparently untouched since the late 1970s.

"The fans were spinning and the furs were spotless," said Haskins. "Everything inside was very nice and clean. The fan was set on 65 degrees and that is exactly what the thermometer read. Everyone wants to know who has been paying the electricity bill."

Haskins, 56, bought J&H Hardware in May and the building — a three-story structure on the village square — in September. In surveying the basement, he figured there might be usable space hidden behind a wall that had hinges on it.

With son Jeremy Haskins, 27, he rented an electric hammer and then a jackhammer and eventually bored through 18 inches of brick and mortar, four inches of wallboard and then a cement wall to find the room once used by Royal Furriers, a business that closed in the late 1970s.

Haskins said he had no idea what the coats are worth, but planned to have them appraised.

It was unclear whether anyone could step forward to claim a long-lost coat — or whether anyone who did would be on the hook for 30 years of storage fees.

 

[JimR]

Someone must be Bellowing up there right about now about furs.

 

[Bobcat]

That's what I was thinking. Protesters marching outside the hardware store with anti-fur slogans on their signs, throwing paint ballons at the windows, and later someone will fire-bomb the building. Poor guy standing in the rubble the next morning saying "I just sell hardware, what did I do?".

 

[JimR]

That's what I was thinking. Protesters marching outside the hardware store with anti-fur slogans on their signs, throwing paint ballons at the windows, and later someone will fire-bomb the building. Poor guy standing in the rubble the next morning saying "I just sell hardware, what did I do?".

The Anti's would all be out of staters that moved there for peace and tranquility.

 

[Melensdad]

Have any statistics on people in the U.S that own fur clothing?

Just looking for a definition here, are we including things like shearling jackets, boots, slippers? Those are just fur turned with the pelt inside. What about non-meat leathers like goatskin? Most folks don't eat goat but they make nice coats and gloves. Leather interiors in cars/trucks? Leather boots, handbags, belts? Rabbit lined gloves. What about eelskin wallets and alligator watchbands (real alligator, not leather stamped to look like it), as well as ostrich leather cowboy boots, briefcases, etc? Anyone else really like sharkskin leather, it makes great watchbands for dive watches (it's waterproof you know!)?

My point is where will we draw the line at who is a hypocrite when it comes to using animals for our benefit?

More I think about it, we have more dead animals in our house than living animals. I think we have something or another from every animal I listed except the ostrich.

Cityboy . . . not overly expensive for fur. Its a dual animal coat with a collar, cuffs and trim from one species and the body of the coat from another. Not sure how many animal pelts are in the coat. The way I see it, we grow Christmas trees for one purpose, to adorn the inside of your house for 2 or 3 weeks a year. If the tree doesn't get sold it never reaches it full glory. Ditto with pelts. They exist for responsible use and if they are not utilized then their beauty is never fully explored, seen or appreciated.

 

[JimR]

Just looking for a definition here, are we including things like shearling jackets, boots, slippers? Those are just fur turned with the pelt inside. What about non-meat leathers like goatskin? Most folks don't eat goat but they make nice coats and gloves. Leather interiors in cars/trucks? Leather boots, handbags, belts? Rabbit lined gloves. What about eelskin wallets and alligator watchbands (real alligator, not leather stamped to look like it), as well as ostrich leather cowboy boots, briefcases, etc? Anyone else really like sharkskin leather, it makes great watchbands for dive watches (it's waterproof you know!)?

My point is where will we draw the line at who is a hypocrite when it comes to using animals for our benefit?

More I think about it, we have more dead animals in our house than living animals. I think we have something or another from every animal I listed except the ostrich.

Cityboy . . . not overly expensive for fur. Its a dual animal coat with a collar, cuffs and trim from one species and the body of the coat from another. Not sure how many animal pelts are in the coat. The way I see it, we grow Christmas trees for one purpose, to adorn the inside of your house for 2 or 3 weeks a year. If the tree doesn't get sold it never reaches it full glory. Ditto with pelts. They exist for responsible use and if they are not utilized then their beauty is never fully explored, seen or appreciated.

Geez Bob, I didn't even think about leather interiors. My four BMW's (old) all have leather. The wife and daughter's cars have leather too.

 

[Melensdad]

Geez Bob, I didn't even think about leather interiors.

Well isn't leather just fur that had been shaved?

Granted, leather typically comes from a cow. And cows edible. But cows are not vermin like muskrats, raccoons, nutria, mink or sable, none of which are actually friendly little creatures we'd like to have interacting with the family cat. But while a glorified rodent or other such vermin is usually mean and of a nasty disposition, it is also true that typical fur bearing animals make nice soft/fuzzy coats, gloves, and boots.

 

[dzalphakilo]

Just looking for a definition here, are we including things like shearling jackets, boots, slippers? Those are just fur turned with the pelt inside. What about non-meat leathers like goatskin? Most folks don't eat goat but they make nice coats and gloves. Leather interiors in cars/trucks? Leather boots, handbags, belts? Rabbit lined gloves. What about eelskin wallets and alligator watchbands (real alligator, not leather stamped to look like it), as well as ostrich leather cowboy boots, briefcases, etc? Anyone else really like sharkskin leather, it makes great watchbands for dive watches (it's waterproof you know!)?

Point taken Bob. I'll admit that I have leather car seats on the used car I bought. Shucks, I even have a milt sparks holster and belt in sharkskin. Please don't tell me you have a leather band for a divers watch though. Those were the kind of guys we made fun of on the boat ( EDIT: come to think of it, never saw a guy with a leather band for a dive watch, thinking about it, how would it hold up in salt water?)

Since for some reason I can't keep up with posts in order once they get over 10 or so, I may of missed it, but did you ever answer my question per your wife being in a soreity (sp?)?

Just for curiosity sake at this point. I'm playing the odds and figuring I'm right. Just curious if my observations may be off.

 

[mtntopper]

My wife and I like to hunt. Here is a pic of the elk killed by my wife this year with the hide/fur still on the animal. We donated the hide to the local Elks club that has the elk hides tanned and made into fingerless elk skin gloves for handicapped wheel chair users. Utilizing the animal for the greatest benefit of humans is the proper usage of any animal. Wearing a fur coat if you want to stay warm or even for show is no different than the gal who shows extra leg or smiles coyly at strangers to be noticed. Look at the expense and craziness many people go to in their quest to be seen and noticed by others. We should not condemn before we know all of the facts. I believe that knowing BobS as he posts here, I would have accept that his wife is very deserving and not using the fur coat as a better than thou r-ch b-tch statement as some people might believe or suggest. Envy of others for what they have is just plain jealousy and is often expressed as a negative statement of and towards that person whether deserved or not.

Yes, my wife shot it dead.... and we also eat the meat...and donate the hide to a worthy cause... Shame on us... We have no guilt feeling....it is life, learn to deal and live with it.

 

[JimR]

My wife and I like to hunt. Here is a pic of the elk killed by my wife this year with the hide/fur still on the animal. We donated the hide to the local Elks club that has the elk hides tanned and made into fingerless elk skin gloves for handicapped wheel chair users. Utilizing the animal for the greatest benefit of humans is the proper usage of any animal. Wearing a fur coat if you want to stay warm or even for show is no different than the gal who shows extra leg or smiles coyly at strangers to be noticed. Look at the expense and craziness many people go to in their quest to be seen and noticed by others. We should not condemn before we know all of the facts. I believe that knowing BobS as he posts here, I would have accept that his wife is very deserving and not using the fur coat as a better than thou r-ch b-tch statement as some people might believe or suggest. Envy of others for what they have is just plain jealousy and is often expressed as a negative statement of and towards that person whether deserved or not.

Yes, my wife shot it dead.... and we also eat the meat...and donate the hide to a worthy cause... Shame on us... We have no guilt feeling....it is life, learn to deal and live with it.
View attachment 19007

Wow, I love your wife already and I don't even know here. I wish my wife would do something like that. I'm jealous as hell that you got your wife for a hunting partner.

 

[Melensdad]

Please don't tell me you have a leather band for a divers watch though. . . I may of missed it, but did you ever answer my question per your wife being in a soreity (sp?)?

I have several dive watches. My Breitling has a sharkskin strap that has been on the watch for several years and has been underwater in the Gulf of Mexico, Atlantic Ocean and the Caribbean. If tanned properly it holds up very well. I also have dive watches with rubber straps, I don't like them as well as sharkskin.

As for my wife, she is hard to pigeon hole into a neat little package like you seem to want to do. Yes, she was in the Kappa Kappa Gamma sorority in college. She climbed mountains and has repelled down cliffs. She was also a double major Political Science & History and went on to earn an MBA. She also was R.O.T.C. trained on the M16 and she was a princess at the Indianapolis 500 and she and I sat on the "Winner's Circle" and took a few laps in the pace car too. So she is a beautiful woman, with brains, who can field strip an assault weapon. Any more questions?

 

[JimR]

I have several dive watches. My Breitling has a sharkskin strap that has been on the watch for several years and has been underwater in the Gulf of Mexico, Atlantic Ocean and the Caribbean. If tanned properly it holds up very well. I also have dive watches with rubber straps, I don't like them as well as sharkskin.

As for my wife, she is hard to pigeon hole into a neat little package like you seem to want to do. Yes, she was in the Kappa Kappa Gamma sorority in college. She climbed mountains and has repelled down cliffs. She was also a double major Political Science & History and went on to earn an MBA. She also was R.O.T.C. trained on the M16 and she was a princess at the Indianapolis 500 and she and I sat on the "Winner's Circle" and took a few laps in the pace car too. So she is a beautiful woman, with brains, who can field strip an assault weapon. Any more questions?

Wow, A real American Lady. More power to her Bob. Would she be interested in running for President?

 

[Cityboy]

Cityboy . . . not overly expensive for fur. Its a dual animal coat with a collar, cuffs and trim from one species and the body of the coat from another. Not sure how many animal pelts are in the coat. The way I see it, we grow Christmas trees for one purpose, to adorn the inside of your house for 2 or 3 weeks a year. If the tree doesn't get sold it never reaches it full glory. Ditto with pelts. They exist for responsible use and if they are not utilized then their beauty is never fully explored, seen or appreciated.

What kind of critters was the coat made of? Goat? Sheep? Dog? Cat? Skunk? Coon? Rabbit? Squirrell? or possum?

It wuz possum, wuddnt it?

 

[daedong]

Live in Australia and you don't need any sort of coat.

Now I don't know about the USA but if we shipped all the pelts from road kill to you, you would never need to kill again for warmth.

http://www.joe-ks.com/archives_sep2003/RoadKill.gif

Bob, In this day and age why would you want to wear fur, there are many cheaper options that are as good. Wearing fur is simply considered ostentatious.

 

[fogtender]

Ok, I'm asking for a time, date and manufacturing facility.

Well then give me a product and what region it came from with the time, date and I will let you know what eco system was affected, most people could figure that out on their own, but I will help you out.

Have any statistics on people in the U.S that own fur clothing? I'd be willing to bet that the majority that own fur do not collect food stamps.

I would have to assume that you have the statistics since you have bashed everyone with your offhanded statements, unless you have no clue and are going by a "Group Hug" mentality. As far as the ones that collect food stamps, I am sure that if the Salvation Army had them for sale, they would buy one.

You say you have deer stand out behind your house you bow hunt from.... That makes you no different from someone who traps or farms fur for a living, you both kill, which by the way I have no problem with either.

As far as the "Fur Farms", they don't raise Wolf, lynx, coyote, bear, seal, and a host of other critters that people wear.... they are taken in the wild.

 

[dzalphakilo]

Well then give me a product and what region it came from with the time, date and I will let you know what eco system was affected, most people could figure that out on their own, but I will help you out.

I would have to assume that you have the statistics since you have bashed everyone with your offhanded statements, unless you have no clue and are going by a "Group Hug" mentality. As far as the ones that collect food stamps, I am sure that if the Salvation Army had them for sale, they would buy one.

You say you have deer stand out behind your house you bow hunt from.... That makes you no different from someone who traps or farms fur for a living, you both kill, which by the way I have no problem with either.

As far as the "Fur Farms", they don't raise Wolf, lynx, coyote, bear, seal, and a host of other critters that people wear.... they are taken in the wild.

Well if most people can figure that out, lets take a popular outdoor clothing brand manufacturer like Marmot. Don't own anything produced by that manufacturer, but since it seems so easy from your end, guess it wouldn't be a problem for you letting me in on what eco system that manufacturer has altered making their "fake fur". I still can't wait...
Since it's so easy, you can just give me two examples on your own if you'd like.

READ DUDE!!! I said I came to form my opinions from my own observations. No, I don't have any statistics, but since you seem so convinced otherwise, figure it shouldn't be a problem on your end to provide me with something to show me that there wasn't a corrolation at all. Guess not, huh? I would guess your observations would differ from my observations due to our local enviroment.

I get a kick out of some of you people. Just as I mentioned, I also mentioned that I do work with a local animal organization here in my county. Some people fall over dead when they find out I hunt. For some reason people tend to think that if you actually care about animals or the enviroment, you're supposed to live in a treehouse or something. Cityboy mentioned that he gave up hunting for various reasons. I was almost there with a rifle, but bow hunting has made it more of a challange. I consider my hunting ethics strong. Hunters are like everyone else, you have some good and some bad. Fact is most hunters realize (particularly on the east coast) that wildlife management is a must, as well as land managment if they want their sport to survive.

You mentioned on another thread that "The reason the State of Alaska has so many wolves is because of the control that the State has over them, not because the activist are "saving" them... Most of the control and preservation is from the hunters and the fees that they pay to keep the wildlife at healthy levels for them and the hunters."
Well, not that it's worth anything, but I happen to agree with 110%. Smart hunters probably do more to save their "sport" than anti hunters who just don't want to see bambi killed. That said, as CB mentioned, there are a lot of idiots out there with guns who like to have an excuse to drink.

Talk about observations. Bob mentioned "tree hugger" here. Funny, I've been called a tree hugger one time in my life. When I moved into Winston, my first roomates were two girls. One girl who was pretty cool who also rented, and the other girl actually owned the house. The girl who owned the house was a former soreity chick (ok, little plump but still a little hot) who had daddy buy her the house. Her daddy also also helped her with the car. This girl was a total BITCH, believe me. I work hard, and here is this girl in here mid twenties going out with her friends coming home during the middle of the week late at night all drunk and crap keeping me up at night. I got so freaking sick of it I stayed up one night waiting for them. Sure enough, around 1:30 in the morning here come six of them in drunk. This time I was waiting at the kitchen table with my AR stripped doing a cleaning with the smell of clp in the air. You should of seen those people's faces, it was a hoot, scared the living shit of them.

Man, I could tell you stories about that one spoiled girl who owned that house (like borrowing the neighbors garden house and never returning it, this after she just moved in). One weekend when I was up in W.V she had a house party and all the neighbors called the cops on here, sorry I missed that one). Sorry, not much to do with the topic, but thought it was a funny story AND that same chick who used daddy's money, who rented out her new house, that seemed to care about no one other than herself, or if she showed an interest in you it was usually for her own personal gain....guess what? She owned a fur coat. Imagine that Did I mention she was a member of a soriety?

Like I said, no statistics, only observations in life. They help me to form my opinoins. Likewise, you have your enviroment that you "experience" to help you form your opinion.

Dude, you have no problem with fur farming, more power to you. I do.

 

[dzalphakilo]

As for my wife, she is hard to pigeon hole into a neat little package like you seem to want to do. Yes, she was in the Kappa Kappa Gamma sorority in college.

Thats all I needed to know Bob, thank you for answering.

I asked because I was curious if there was a corrolation between those women who owned furs and if they belonged in a soriety in their past. From my experience for some reason, their is a high corrolation. By the same token, I'd be willing to bet with fogtender living in his enviroment, he may have different observations of those women who wear fur that help him form his opinion.

Bob, I'm sure your wife is a great woman. In life we all can be stereotyped, which I am as guilty of doing as well.

 

[dzalphakilo]

I have several dive watches. My Breitling has a sharkskin strap that has been on the watch for several years and has been underwater in the Gulf of Mexico, Atlantic Ocean and the Caribbean. If tanned properly it holds up very well. I also have dive watches with rubber straps, I don't like them as well as sharkskin.

Just curious, do you have a dive computer?

If I remember correctly, I did come across one guy who had a leather dive watch years ago and it didn't hold up very well. Could just be the leather.

Anyone want to get into a discussion if divers should "interact" with marine life

 

[XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq]

As for my wife, she is hard to pigeon hole into a neat little package

Bob, she sounds like a nice little package! You're a lucky boy!

 

[JimR]

Anyone want to get into a discussion if divers should "interact" with marine life

Ever get to play with a Great White?


Only Kidding.