• Please be sure to read the rules and adhere to them. Some banned members have complained that they are not spammers. But they spammed us. Some even tried to redirect our members to other forums. Duh. Be smart. Read the rules and adhere to them and we will all get along just fine. Cheers. :beer: Link to the rules: https://www.forumsforums.com/threads/forum-rules-info.2974/

Debate Thread

All I can say is........sucks to be you guys. If a country who's claim to fame is that they are the so called greatest country in the world (not) can only produce these two baboons as their potential leaders for the next 4 years (actually 3 if you don't count the wasted year campaigning for the following election), then what does that say about the country as a whole?


37f38389c301f1144703c6e30c59a6f8.jpg


Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
 
THE HILL: Trump won with 58%, Hillary had 36% and undecided/tie had 6%

Drudge Poll, Trump won with roughly 80% of the vote

TIME Magazine Poll, Trump won with roughly 52% of the vote

CNBC Poll, Trump won with roughly 64% of the vote

FORTUNE Magazine multi-question poll:

Trump overall winner of the debate: 52%
Trump strongest on the economy with 56%
Trump strongest on national security with 55%
Trump wins clearest vision of America with 52%
Did the debate change your mind ... NO = 80%; YES = 13%; still undecided = 7%
​


Note, as all of the above polls are still open there will probably be some movement in the poll results over the next day or so.

----- NONE of the above polls was a scientific sampling poll ------


CNN did a statistical sampling poll of Registered Voters.
The poll was weighted 41% Democratic which over-represented the Democratic party, while underrepresented the Republicans with only 26% of the polling sample by about 2%. 33% identified themselves as Independents. Poll has a 4.5% margin of error

Hillary won with 62%, Trump only had 27% saying he won.
BOTH won had 6% of the votes, NEITHER won the debate had 4% and NO OPINION had 1%.

In the part of the survey asking about specific policy issues, Clinton won every segment:
Stronger Leader: Clinton = 56%
Foreign Policy: Clinton = 62%
Terrorism: Clinton = 54%
Economy: Clinton = 51%
​
 
J5 Bombardier said:
Canadians have nothing to be smug about , considering our current government / prime minister !
Click to expand...
I agree. But generally we don't go around flaunting pretending to be the greatest country on earth. Given the choice between our current leader and those two clowns that were on TV last night it wouldn't be too difficult who to choose. [emoji3]

Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
 
----------- FOCUS GROUPS ----------------

There were at least 2 "Focus Group" results from last night.

CNN and Frank Luntz each had groups watch the debate. Both groups felt Hillary won the debate.

CNN Focus Group (20): 18 chose Clinton, 2 favored Trump
LUNTZ Focus Group (24): 16 picked Clinton, 6 chose Trump




---------- PERHAPS the most interesting result I've seen so far ------------

The BREITBART/GRAVIS poll, which is a statistical sampling poll, said that most people thought Hillary won the debate with 48%, while 43% thought Trump did the best, the remainder were undecided/ties. So Hillary beat Trump by 5% overall.

BUT, among the self identified INDEPENDENT voters it appears that Trump was the winner. 95% of the people polled said the debate did NOT change their vote. Two percent of voters, previously undecided, switched to Trump after the debate. No undecideds went to Clinton. One percent switched from Trump to Clinton, and one percent switched from Clinton to Trump.
 
NorthernRedneck said:
I agree. But generally we don't go around flaunting pretending to be the greatest country on earth. Given the choice between our current leader and those two clowns that were on TV last night it wouldn't be too difficult who to choose. [emoji3]

Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Yeah, I'm not sure if we are the greatest country in the world anymore by the proper definition, whatever that may be.

I do find it interesting that when the Europeans get their tits in a wringer over something who do they always call to bail their asses out of a jam? WW1, WW2 come to mind right off the bat.

The easiest thing to do is to always sit on the sidelines and judge those that take the lead and make the decisions, whether they be right or wrong.

Maybe going forward, the phone to use for help may be Putin's. I have no idea.
 
TiredRetired said:
Yeah, I'm not sure if we are the greatest country in the world anymore by the proper definition, whatever that may be.

I do find it interesting that when the Europeans get their tits in a wringer over something who do they always call to bail their asses out of a jam? WW1, WW2 come to mind right off the bat.

The easiest thing to do is to always sit on the sidelines and judge those that take the lead and make the decisions, whether they be right or wrong.

Maybe going forward, the phone to use for help may be Putin's. I have no idea.
Click to expand...

Overall the Europeans get all fussy about the USA every day of their lives. But you are correct, in the end, they turn to us to actually do something after their hand wringing and whining doesn't accomplish anything.

Europeans think we need to see a more world view, we need to travel to understand their point of view, etc etc etc. And while I am pretty well traveled I am always happy to come back home because yes, we are that much better. And I think Canadian travelers fall into a category that is similar to the US in terms of being thrilled to get back from Europe and into a modern civilization. Europe, everywhere is just old, run down, often dirty, sometimes smelly, and mostly broken. So are we the "best" country in the world? Yes, we probably are, but not by as wide a margin as we used to be. Should we be smug about it, the facts are clear, we are better, too bad if they don't like it.


BUT BACK TO THE DEBATE ---------->

From everything I can tell, the PROFESSIONAL PUNDITS believe that Hillary won. They think she was the calmer, cooler and more level debater. On technical points they consider the debate a slam dunk for Hillary.

That said it appears that they collectively don't think it really mattered too much. There was no knock out. They don't see it saying much overall.

FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF THE PEOPLE it appears that, at least a slight majority of independents, may have been slightly swayed toward Trump. The 'online' polls all seem to sway toward Trump as the winner. Nobody seems to have seen Hillary knock out Trump, most people seem to expect Trump to get upset and fight back, and he did so that was not a surprise.


After staying up late and getting up early and looking at as much as I could find, I'd say that the debate had little to no effect on the trajectory of the election. At least I hope that is true because Trump had the momentum going into the debate and I think that may continue.
 
Melensdad said:

BUT BACK TO THE DEBATE ---------->

From everything I can tell, the PROFESSIONAL PUNDITS believe that Hillary won. They think she was the calmer, cooler and more level debater. On technical points they consider the debate a slam dunk for Hillary.

That said it appears that they collectively don't think it really mattered too much. There was no knock out. They don't see it saying much overall.

FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF THE PEOPLE it appears that, at least a slight majority of independents, may have been slightly swayed toward Trump. The 'online' polls all seem to sway toward Trump as the winner. Nobody seems to have seen Hillary knock out Trump, most people seem to expect Trump to get upset and fight back, and he did so that was not a surprise.


After staying up late and getting up early and looking at as much as I could find, I'd say that the debate had little to no effect on the trajectory of the election. At least I hope that is true because Trump had the momentum going into the debate and I think that may continue.
Click to expand...

You have drawn pretty much the same conclusions I have. The pundits and talking heads give the edge to Killery, but the on line polls seem to favor Trump. It was obvious from the git go that Killery's plan was to avoid the issues and make this a debate about Donald's character. They knew they had Lester on their side and decided to take advantage of it. They know one of the debates will be on FNC and those moderators will make a better attempt at staying on topic and discussing the issues.

Many said going into this debate that all Trump needed to do was not get blown out of the water. That most certainly did not happen. Remember, Killery is a seasoned debater who gave the Kenyan all he could handle in 08 and the Kenyan is no slouch on the debate stage himself when he brings his A game.

Which brings us to Lester Holt. He succeeded is dragging the debate to the left in six ways as follows:
1) Jobs: Holt pressed Trump with two questions on how he was going to add jobs even though the first answer discussed renegotiating trade deals.

2) Taxes: He portrayed the tax plans from the left – Clinton wanting to tax the rich and Trump “calling for tax cuts for the wealthy,” forcing Trump to correct him.

3) Tax Returns: Trump got hit hard with tax return questions for “business conflicts” while Hillary got a slide on emails, her hidden speeches and Clinton Foundation business conflicts.

4) Birthers: Holt asked a “birther” question that lasted longer than Clinton’s email answer. He then added three separate follow-ups to jam up Trump.

5) Iraq: He hammered Trump for supporting the Iraq War, downplaying how Hillary had voted to do the same.

6) Hillary’s Gaffe: When asked about biased policing, Clinton said, “I think implicit bias is a problem for everyone, not just police.” Holt ignored it, rather than challenge the idea everyone is bigoted.

Lester Holt's performance last evening was abominable.
 
Last edited:
TiredRetired said:
You have drawn pretty much the same conclusions I have. The pundits and talking heads give the edge to Killery, but the on line polls seem to favor Trump. . .
Click to expand...

Interesting view of news HEADLINES from around the country. Clearly some show bias toward their favorite candidate but overall I'd say that they lean toward Trump. Some of these headlines are neutral. Some admit that Trump didn't do well but that didn't hurt him. I think the national headlines are somewhat telling of the mood of the nation.

  • The Fiercest Presidential Debate in Modern Times Susan Page, USA Today
  • Donald Trump's Missed Opportunities Byron York, Washington Examiner
  • What Worked in Primaries Failed Trump Against Clinton Dana Milbank, Wash Post
  • Clinton Not Good Enough to Stop Her Slide Eric Fehrnstrom, Boston Globe
  • At First Debate, Hillary Clinton Proves She's Got This Michelle Goldberg, Slate
  • Trump Was Terrible. But Will It Matter? Howard Fineman, Huffington Post
  • Clinton Clings to the Myth of Systemic Racism Edmund Kozak, LifeZette
  • After First Debate, "Nobody Knows Anything" Roger L. Simon, PJ Media
  • First Debate Proved What We Knew: Trump Is a Monster Brian Beutler, New Republic
  • How Trump Won Over a Bar Full of Undecideds and Dems Salena Zito, New York Post
  • Clinton Dominated Debate, Pa. Focus Group Says Rebecca Berg, RealClearPolitics
  • Clinton Needs Obama to Carry Her Across the Finish Line Carl Bernstein, CNN
  • Which Candidate Helped His or Her Cause Most? Charles Lipson, RealClearPolitics
  • Round One a Draw--and That's Bad News for Hillary Clinton New York Post
  • Trump Takes Clinton's Bait in the First Debate Los Angeles Times
I think what is most interesting are the headlines that seem to indicate Trump did better but came from Liberal news sources. I expect a liberal news source like SLATE to skew toward Hillary, and they did not disappoint. I expect a conservative course to skew to the right but they seemed much more subdued. Its the liberal sources that showed that Hillary lost ground that probably are the most telling about the real results.
​
 
TiredRetired said:
If it was anybody but Trump, I would agree with you, but Trump is a different breed of cat. The other side must be pulling their hair out on which Trump will show up. He's a cagey bastard if there ever was one. Piece of work that boy.

BYW, I prefer the right foot. :yum:
Click to expand...


I watched a bit and it was as expected, Trump had to deal with a liberal moderator as well as hitlery. Why the republican party and their candidates for president put up with this so called non-partisan debate committee is beyond me.
 
Interesting graphics on a global scale this morning.
 

Attachments

  • trump-clinton-poll.jpg
    trump-clinton-poll.jpg
    18.5 KB · Views: 78
  • trump-clinton-global-poll.jpg
    trump-clinton-global-poll.jpg
    21 KB · Views: 77
and US electoral map..
 

Attachments

  • Clinton-Trump-2016-Electoral-Map-Trump-Wins-640x480[3].jpg
    Clinton-Trump-2016-Electoral-Map-Trump-Wins-640x480[3].jpg
    58.3 KB · Views: 77
PG - Whose electoral maps are those? It's encouraging to see, but very much counter to every other electoral college map I have seen thus far.

IMO regarding the debate: Trump's unabated conceit and narcissism killed him last night. Had he prepared for the debate, rather than just "being Trump", he could have easily hit out of the park several of the dozens of low hanging fast balls which he just watched wizz past him.

Hillery was prepared and looked it. Trump wasn't and looked it. Will this debate make much difference in the end? I seriously doubt it.

Advantage: Hillery.
 
Av8r3400 said:
PG - Whose electoral maps are those? It's encouraging to see, but very much counter to every other electoral college map I have seen thus far.

IMO regarding the debate: Trump's unabated conceit and narcissism killed him last night. Had he prepared for the debate, rather than just "being Trump", he could have easily hit out of the park several of the dozens of low hanging fast balls which he just watched wizz past him.

Hillery was prepared and looked it. Trump wasn't and looked it. Will this debate make much difference in the end? I seriously doubt it.

Advantage: Hillery.
Click to expand...

From what I have been reading the last few days, that map is up to date. Klinton has pulled out of Ohio yesterday and given up on it. The day before she gave an anti fracking speech in Michigan basically saying she will do the same thing to fracking that the Kenyan has done to coal. Regulate it to death, thereby costing Ohioans thousands of jobs and handing back to her buddies the Moslems the majority of the gas and oil production. She is dead to Ohio.

NC and FLA are swinging right big time and she stands little chance of winning those states. As a matter of fact Michigan and PA are getting more and more in play every day and that is where she has redirected the monies previously allocated to Ohio.

Things are looking good and I saw nothing last night that should stop the Trump Train.

Chooo, chooo, chooo, time to get on board, boy!
 
Av8r3400 said:
PG - Whose electoral maps are those? It's encouraging to see, but very much counter to every other electoral college map I have seen thus far.

IMO regarding the debate: Trump's unabated conceit and narcissism killed him last night. Had he prepared for the debate, rather than just "being Trump", he could have easily hit out of the park several of the dozens of low hanging fast balls which he just watched wizz past him.

Hillery was prepared and looked it. Trump wasn't and looked it. Will this debate make much difference in the end? I seriously doubt it.

Advantage: Hillery.
Click to expand...

Breitbart had the electoral map, while the other was found at Theo Spark.
Both sites often borrow from the other.

I got a chance to catch up a bit this morning on how the debate went down.
Pretty much no surprises at all.
The media sure had this one wrong the way they were waiting for a showdown.
<yawn> lol
 
MrLiberty said:
CNBC poll says Trump won easily, 67% to 33%

Vote: Who won the first presidential debate?

Time poll says Trump won easily as well 55% to 45%

Presidential Debate: Did Donald Trump or Hillary Clinton Win

She also lost ground in NC

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/new...104382951.html

Majority of snap polls show Trump won.....

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...landslide.html
Click to expand...
What I noticed about the polling was that with the NON-scientific on-line polls Trump was the winner.

With the statistical model polling then Hillary came up as the winner.

What I also noticed was that the experts graded Hillary the winner because of technical debating style. But it seems fairly clear that ordinary people don't give a hoot about "technical debating style" and so the rules used by the experts should probably be thrown away.

I saw the article from the Charlotte Observer early this morning, where Hillary lost ground in North Carolina after the debate. I'm curious to see if that continues. There is a link, I think I posted it, to a story about a group of people in Pennsylvania who were leaning/strong Democrats that watched the debate at the bar ... and walked away switching to Trump. Both the Charlotte Observer story and the story about the bar patrons should be considered reasonable because those stories are about normal folks and what normal people think.

This could get interesting.

I do think that Trump missed several opportunities last night to score points. I think that was a mistake. He didn't have to be mean to bring up some of the issues, but he failed to do so.

All that said, it is hard to dismiss the CNN and similar statistical model polls, the pre-determined groups views, etc.

I said it before, and I'll stick with it. I don't think it changed many people's minds and I doubt it will change Trump's slight lead in momentum.
 
Trump won on some points.
Hillary did on others.
That makes them either a winner or a loser depending on who you are.

Can this election be over already? :yum::hammer::hammer::hammer:
 
Fox News is reporting that Trump has raised over 13 Million over the last 24 hours. All arguing on who won aside, this alone may be the best litmus test of who won.

Follow the money and right now it is following the Donald.
 
Breaking: Reaper POLL Reports 1st debate has no effect on voters polled.

In a grave to grave survey the reaper poll reports that all non respondents will still vote 100% for Hillary in the coming Presidential election.
 
MrLiberty said:
I watched a bit and it was as expected, Trump had to deal with a liberal moderator as well as hitlery. Why the republican party and their candidates for president put up with this so called non-partisan debate committee is beyond me.
Click to expand...
Lester is not a liberal. jus sayin'
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top