"When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

[Cityboy]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Condi is a black Republican. She dared to better herself and leave the Democrat entitlement mentality plantation. She is "Doctor Rice". Highly educated. Speaks several languages, (ebonics not being one of them) and she is an accomplished concert pianist, having played alongside Yoyoma. That is unforgivable to the left.

Even you Dems have to admit she is brilliant.

I'd have to say Hillary is smart in an evil way, but she cannot hold a candle to Condoleeza Rice. You Dems should be proud of Condi. You do after all purport to support minority rights, don't you? Oh, that's right....as long as those minorities know their place on the Democrat plantation.

 

[Doc]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Wrong again. I'm a Dem and I like Condi. I think she is 1000 times better than Hillary. I have to believe that the majority of people do not fit in the categories your labeling everyone with. Most intelligent folks will make up their own mind for each situation, not follow a 'party' line.

 

[thcri]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Hillary is twenty times the women Condi is. Hillary would be capable of running the country where Condi wouldn't know the first thing to do.

What makes your statement any more accurate than mine?

Just look at each of their pasts. I think one could dig up some pretty good stuff about Hillary. Was she not part of some college scandel many years ago ? Did this even involve some deaths. It just seems that I have read so many bad things about her. Do I have proof, not really but when one hears so many bad things about a person you loose faith in them. There was a women many years ago that ran for Vice President with I beleive Mondale, she would be twenty times better than Hillary. Hillary's idea of health care that she has been trying to stuff down our throats is about the worse thing one could ever want and yet she just keeps pushing it. Instead of following Canada's system that stinks why doesn't she come of with her own plan. Talk to any Canadian and they will tell you not to follow their plan as it stinks.

I wouldn't trust Hillary in any level of government and I feel sorry the people in New York. I don't care if one is democrat or republican, I would not trust her in anyway. Gee now that I think of it, was she not also involved in some realestate transactions that were not right also back in her attorney days. I just can't see how anybody could trust that women.

 

[Dargo]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

I wouldn't trust Hillary in any level of government and I feel sorry the people in New York.

I don't feel sorry for them. The move of Hillary to NY was extremely well orchestrated. The Clintons et al spent hundreds of thousands of dollars to find out what area in the country was "democrat enough" to elect Hillary regardless of her past, her qualifications, and her obvious carpet bagger status. New York voters had to know that they were specifically targeted by the Clintons. Her move to NY was quite planned and NY got what they deserve; for better or worse. Their (Clinton's) research was accurate enough to result in fruition. The Clinton's may be a lot of things but, personally, I don't think stupid is one of them.

That being said, I still do not think Billary can hold a candle to Condi. It's one thing to plan and scheme your entire adult life and achieve your goals, but it's entirely another to beat all odds and achieve what Condi has through pure hard work, determination, and doing the right thing. I believe a 4 engine freight train couldn't haul all the baggage that comes with Billary. Without a doubt, she would be a detriment to any democrat ticket. Republicans can only hope that she is somehow attached to the next presidential ticket of the democrats. Conversely, I think Condi would be a great compliment to any Republican ticket. I do not by any means think the dem party is stupid, and I honestly believe that they are very well aware of this fact. I seriously doubt that they will allow Billary to be attached to their ticket, no matter what her personal goals are.

 

[Cityboy]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Doc -

I'm addressing Dems in general, not anyone in particular here. The Democrat party line is what I go after. They just can't get over the 2000 election and the parties shift to the far left and their overall shrillness make them a great target.

Now Doc, I don't think you are really a true Dem. I bet if you checked into political philosophies a little, you might just find you have some Libertarian leanings like me.

The Republicans piss me off because they have the majority and could kick the Dems to the curb if they stood together, but for some reason they just can't get it right. The only reason they will continue to hold the majority, despite Bush's approval rating is because the Dems continue to implode. The Dems will fail again with this latest attempt at the "Bush lied" doctrine. The Dem party leaders just can't collectively pull their heads from their asses long enough to see the light. It' just hillarious to watch.

 

[Doc]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Now Doc, I don't think you are really a true Dem. I bet if you checked into political philosophies a little, you might just find you have some Libertarian leanings like me.

Right on Cityboy. I've been registered independant, rep. and dem. I decided I wanted to have a vote that counted in the primarys so I picked what I thought was the lessor of two evils.

 

[OkeeDon]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

The Republicans piss me off because they have the majority and could kick the Dems to the curb if they stood together...

Same solution you have for the Middle East?

 

[OkeeDon]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Was she not part of some college scandel many years ago ? Did this even involve some deaths. It just seems that I have read so many bad things about her...

No.

Instead of listening to Fox News and absorbing the trash they throw out that just "seems" to sound bad, why not do some real research and discover the truth? I know you won't believe me, so do your own research and see what you can dig up.

 

[OkeeDon]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Condi is a black Republican. She dared to better herself and leave the Democrat entitlement mentality plantation. She is "Doctor Rice". Highly educated. Speaks several languages, (ebonics not being one of them) and she is an accomplished concert pianist, having played alongside Yoyoma. That is unforgivable to the left.

Even you Dems have to admit she is brilliant.

Not exactly. She is a token. She only rose so high in the administration because so damn few blacks are willing to swallow their pride and be a Republican. The ones that do are pretty stupid, seeing how they support the folks that wouldn't let them move into their neighborhood just a few years ago.

Further, she was a college professor. In that world, you get your PhD or have no job. Fortunately, PhD's in political science are relatively easy to achieve. She was a specialist in Soviet politics -- and, of course, they no longer exist. She's a puppet of the Neo's in the Bush administration, just like Bush, himself.

Yes, she is a pretty good concert pianist. Should have stuck to it.

 

[thcri]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

No.

Instead of listening to Fox News and absorbing the trash they throw out that just "seems" to sound bad, why not do some real research and discover the truth? I know you won't believe me, so do your own research and see what you can dig up.

Don,

I don't really care to know the truth. She isn't worth my time of day. When you constantly hear rumors and rumors and rumors it just comes to a time when you just don't trust that person anymore. Fox did not start that rumor, Fox may tend to voice their opinion based on the Republican side, but yet you have CNN, ABC, CBS that voice their opinion on the Democrat side and we can sit back and say, why don't they investigate. Even if I was a dedicated Democrat I would not want Hillary in the office. I think she is a disgrace. I also want you to know that I am not a dedicated Republican. There has been many times over the past few years I have voted both parties. I think all parties play their strategy games. Democrats and Republicans both have lied to us over the years and each and every day it is getting worse. As far as Bush lieing to us, there is no proof of that as of today, Clinton, he lied on TV and then tried denying he lied. The war on Iraq may be wrong, but Bush is doing everything he can to protect our freedom. And going to war is not his final decision. This was all approved by the Senate and the house.

I will bow out now as Hillary is not even to me worth talking about in my book.

 

[OkeeDon]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Murph, I will only say that you have been sucked in by the same type of lies and misrepresentation that is the subject of this thread. Why does it seem like whenever there are lies and misrepresentations, the Republicans are involved?

 

[thcri]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Murph, I will only say that you have been sucked in by the same type of lies and misrepresentation that is the subject of this thread. Why does it seem like whenever there are lies and misrepresentations, the Republicans are involved?

So the Democrats never lied Don?? And I have been sucket in? The lies in the Democrat party started way back when John Kennedy was President. John was not faithful, Dumb shit Ted in his scandels. I can still remember good ole Ted on the panel for Clarence Thomas for the Supreme Court. Of all people to be on the supreme court panel. This whole country has been sucked in by lies including yourself. You can go up one side and down the other and you will find all kinds of lies and for you to say I got sucked in?? Right Don, but I personall think that maybe you got sucked in also.

I respect your opinion on many things Don, but this is one area I think your not looking on both sides, only your side, typicall full fledged Democrat.


You can say what you want in return, but I am done, for you to say I got sucked in is arrogant, Bush wailed on Kerry, one of the biggest popular vote defiets recorded so what you are saying is the majority of this county is a bunch of losers sucked in by the present administration, yeah right

 

[OkeeDon]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Bush wailed on Kerry, one of the biggest popular vote defiets recorded...

Where do you get this stuff? Even Fox News has never tried to pass off that kind of claptrap.

The final Bush/Kerry electoral college vote was Bush: 286 vs Kerry: 252. 270 are needed to win. If just 18 votes were shifted, Kerry would have won. All it would have taken is for either Ohio or Florida to go for Kerry, and it would have been a totally different result. And, the vote in both Ohio and Florida was close. In fact, similar to Florida in 2000, Ohio trashed more than enough votes to move the election to Kerry. Some people are claiming that the Republicans stole the election again, this time in Ohio.

Regardless, your idea that that "Bush wailed on Kerry" is just plain silly. The vote was close until the last possible moments.

I don't have to comment on your other notions; they're just as silly as that one. Try FACTS.

By the way, the popular vote, which really doesn't matter, was Bush-50.7% to Kerry-48.2%. That isn't "wailing" on him, either.

 

[Cityboy]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Same solution you have for the Middle East?

The Democrack way has not worked. Just be nice to them and maybe they won't blow us up.

You are definately a died in the wool yellow dog Democrat Don. You would think Clinton, Hillary, Kerry et al were saints even if they were caught red handed committing murder, gun in hand, corpse on the floor with 50 witnesses. It would have to be a Republican lie, wouldn't it? That vast right wing conspiracy Hitlary talks about.

You sound just like those folks over at Democrack Underground. Just curious...are you a member there? Your propaganda sounds like DU dittos

Anyway, we will never convince you to change your political philosophy and you certainly will never see me vote for a Dem in my lifetime, but I will stand up and criticize the Republican party when they fail to do what they were sent to Washington by the voters to do, unlike the hardline Democrat lemmings, who now matter how far to the left the party goes, no matter how shrill they become, even as they continue to implode will still blindly support the insanity.

And hell yes! Lets nuke Iran before they nuke Israel or us. Did you hear Iran's president on the news today calling for the complete destruction of Israel to the screaming delight of the peaceful muslim crowd? Lets hear the leftist solution to that problem.

 

[bczoom]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

You are definately a died in the wool yellow dog Democrat Don.

CB (et. al.)
We're bordering on personal attacks here... Not good.
Please discuss without hitting/slamming on other members.
Wording should be directed to the issue and not towards members.

Thanks.
Brian

 

[Cityboy]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Brian,

No personal attacks on my part. I did not intend to slam Don, and I bet he would not be offended at being called a "Yellow dog Dem". That's an old term created by hard core Democrats regarding their party loyalty. I'm sure Don is far more offended by my political opinions.

When you jump into the political mud pit, one must be prepared to get splashed and not allow onself to become upset about it. I love to discuss politics. Everybody needs to remember that everyone has their personal philosophy and opinion and when you post your thoughts on the subject, other folks will reply. You gotta be able to deal with with the replys.

 

[bczoom]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

CB,

This thread and the Photo ID thread "appear" to have become a testament of wills between you and OD.
Everyone understands the mud pit when politics are discussed but we don't want things to get out of control. Each can have their "personal philosophy" but to generate even a perceived attack on a person is not the approach. You may attack their stance but not the person.
Please try to avoid "you" from the context of the message and only spew your thoughts based on content of the subject, not the contributing member.

Much appreciated.
Brian

 

[Cityboy]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

CB,

Please try to avoid "you" from the context of the message and only spew your thoughts based on content of the subject, not the contributing member.

Much appreciated.
Brian

That's a tall order, Brian! But I'll do my best

 

[OkeeDon]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

In the interests of setting the record straight, I will respond one more time.

I bet he would not be offended at being called a "Yellow dog Dem".

You lose your bet.

I'm sure Don is far more offended by my political opinions.

Wrong again. I'm not offended by your opinions. I'm offended by your attitude, which appears to be to try to create strife and disruption.

 

[Cityboy]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Don,

How can you determine one's attitude by reading words on a computer screen? Give that some thought, please.

I have fun talking politics. It is a two way street, and when something is said to the effect that "so-n-so has been sucked in by Fox news" or make a blanket statement like "Why does it seem like whenever there are lies and misrepresentations, the Republicans are involved?" or vice-versa for those on the right, people are going to respond in kind. When one dishes out, one must prepare to take back. I love to do both.

I thought you would consider being referred to as a Yellow Dog Dem a compliment. That was my intenet at least. Are you familiar with the story behind the term? Anyhow, no offense intended.

All:

It would be no fun here whatsoever if everyone agreed on everything. I agree we should be polite to each other, but not to the extent that we superficially kiss each others butts in an attempt to appear nice. Lets passionately argue our positions and shake hands at the end of the day and not be so thinned skinned that we become offended at the slightest difference to our personal opinions. Even if you get pissed, you can get over it.

Now...Who wants to argue with me?

 

[Cityboy]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

As an afterthought....

Where is California during this debate?

He dropped this roadside bomb and left us to deal with it

So...whatcha think Cali? Pretty good response eh?

 

[AndyM]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Don,

How can you determine one's attitude by reading words on a computer screen? Give that some thought, please.

That's easy...
I think if your arguement is valid and strong, you should be able to make it without the name calling. Terms like "Democracks" and "Hitlary" shouldn't be necessary if everything you say has merit to it.

As a registered Republican, I don't always agree with the party I voted for, but there's nothing that turns me off more than name calling from either party. I think if an office holder or political party is worth all they claim to be, then you should be able to show all of there positives, rather than resorting to name calling. There's better ways to make a point than resorting to name calling.

Just my opinion. Other opinions may differ.

 

[Cityboy]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

If you can't have fun playing the game, then why play? I don't get offended by people referring to the Repubs as "Neo's", Repugs etc. I think Hillary Clinton is an evil dangerous bitch. That's my opinion. I find "Hitlary" appropos. Don't like my opinion? You're not required to like it. Offended by it? That's your issue alone to deal with. Taking oneself too seriously causes hypertension and hemmoroids. Relax. Enjoy the debate.

So tell me Andy...exactly what is my attitiude since you can so easily read my mind across the internet? And while you're at it, what's the winning Georgia Lotto numbers for this evenings drawing? I'll split it with ya.

 

[AndyM]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

So tell me Andy...exactly what is my attitiude since you can so easily read my mind across the internet?

Relax there buddy... just stating my opinion towards politics and name-calling. I think I'm entitiled to have one without getting attacked.



By the way, I voted for Bush twice. His performance as President has been utterly disappointing and there isn't much lately I agree with him on.

I'm not the typical Republican (I think that's why Don and I get along)...
I come out and state it when I don't agree with Bush on something, rather than defend him simply because he was "my" candidate. I will state however, no matter how bad his presidency has been, he still seems to have been the better choice that either Gore or Kerry.
I can only hope that 2008 has better choices!


Now I'm going to go outside and do some yardwork with the tractors. Anyone in the area is welcome to join me!

 

[OkeeDon]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

I will state however, no matter how bad his presidency has been, he still seems to have been the better choice that either Gore or Kerry.

That's pretty much what some other folks have said, too. That's a valid opinion, but I was very much a member of the ABB faction: "Anbody But Bush". In my opinion, he is so unqualified, and so far removed from reality, and so influenced by his "people" who have their own agendas, that we would have been better off with Mortimer Snerd. I guess I got too used to Bill Clinton, who everyone -- including his enemies -- described as a "wonk" because he knew everything that was going on, and knew everyone's job better than they did. It's a little hard to take a guy who admits he doesn't read any newspaper, or much of anything else, for that matter.

I might be better able to take him if he could pronounce nuclear...I understand he's working on it, working hard, because that's what Presidents do, but it's hard work...

 

[California]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

So...whatcha think Cali? Pretty good response eh?

No.

My hope was that by referencing a primary source, Ambassador Wilson,
we could speculate on where the country is going from this point forward.

The US is at a turning point this week, like when Kennedy was shot or the day Nixon resigned. I hoped we could each add some insight and maybe anticipate a course out of the mess the president is facing right now.

Yours was the first response in the thread. I got to 'you lefties' and realized you probably hadn't read Wilson's statement, rather my post had just triggered another rehash of the 2000 election arguments in your mind. You plunged into name calling without any reference to what Wilson was trying to convey.

We may agree or disagree on what the future will hold but any participant who steers a thread to personal attacks has badly missed the point.

I won't be responding to your posts again. That moon in your post addressed to me is the last thing I want to see from you.

One more time: I think it would be interesting to speculate on how this present crisis will play out. Looking to the future, not the past. And keeping the focus of the thread within the range of real possible outcomes.

 

[Cityboy]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

The US is at a turning point this week, like when Kennedy was shot or the day Nixon resigned. I hoped we could each add some insight and maybe anticipate a course out of the mess the president is facing right now.

Give me a break. I think one would have to stretch pretty hard to compare Libby's indictment to the Kennedy assination or Watergate. This is just another in the ongoing attempts of the ABB gang to embarrass Bush. This too shall pass with no consequenses for this lame duck president.

 

[Cityboy]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

Yours was the first response in the thread. I got to 'you lefties' and realized you probably hadn't read Wilson's statement, rather my post had just triggered another rehash of the 2000 election arguments in your mind. You plunged into name calling without any reference to what Wilson was trying to convey.

We may agree or disagree on what the future will hold but any participant who steers a thread to personal attacks has badly missed the point.

I won't be responding to your posts again. That moon in your post addressed to me is the last thing I want to see from you.

Why is it when you use the term "lefty or righty" that people say they have been "personnaly" attacked?? What is personal about it? If you are a Dem and left of center, shouldn't you be proud of your position? Is there something embarrassing to Dems about being identified as left of center? Have we slipped so far down the slippery slope of political correctness that we can't point out political differences in simple terms? Should we create a politically correct term like: "Left of center American"? How about "Democrat American" or maybe Conservitive Libertarian American"? Exactly what is offensive about the term "righty"? Doesn't bother me in the least. What a sensitive society we have become.

If I call a liberal a liberal, is that offensive? If I call a conservative a conservative, is that offensive? One is left of center, one is right of center. Why is it OK for those on the left to refer to conservatives as "Neocons" but it is not OK for those on the right to call liberals leftists?? A little sensitivity bias perhaps?

I saw this thread for what I believe it to actually be, and that is another slam on the Bush administration and a demonstration that there is a segment of our population that cannot let the 2000 election results go. Like I said before, the Dems need to let the past go and chart a course for the future. I don't know why I would even offer the Dems usable advice like this, but I guess the shrillness from the left has reached the point of sounding pitiful to me. These attempts to disguise the actual intent to bash Bush are so tranparent that they have reached the point of comedy.

Lastly, if my mooning smiley was offensive....well..'nuff said!

 

[Melensdad]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

FIRST POST TO START THREAD:
"... that government becomes a government that preys on the people."

Former U.S. Ambassador Joseph Wilson, speaking at Seattle's Town Hall 10/26/2005.

Wilson was the diplomat who the CIA sent to Niger to investigate rumors of nuclear preparation (WMD for Saddam). He reported back that the rumors were false.

The President continued to rely on unsupported beliefs about WMD's held by his inner circle of advisors, and cited WMD's in his State of the Union address and as the basis for invading Iraq.

Wilson complained that his report had been twisted to the opposite of what he said, which led to retaliation by the White House against him and his wife, Valerie Plame, then leading to the present crisis involving Cheney, Libby, and Rove.

LAST REPLY (edited)

My hope was that by referencing a primary source, Ambassador Wilson,
we could speculate on where the country is going from this point forward.

The US is at a turning point this week, like when Kennedy was shot or the day Nixon resigned. I hoped we could each add some insight and maybe anticipate a course out of the mess the president is facing right now.

Yours was the first response in the thread. I got to 'you lefties' and realized you probably hadn't read Wilson's statement, rather my post had just triggered another rehash of the 2000 election arguments in your mind. You plunged into name calling without any reference to what Wilson was trying to convey.

One more time: I think it would be interesting to speculate on how this present crisis will play out. Looking to the future, not the past. And keeping the focus of the thread within the range of real possible outcomes.

I guess I see it alot differently. First of all Wilson is not the only source to indicate WMD or the lack of WMD. In fact there was plenty of evidence to cause many nations leaders to believe that Sadaam had WMD. Wilson was actually a fairly lonely voice disputing that. Turns out he was likely correct, but I think it is a very long stretch to suggest that Bush relied on an 'inner circle' to justify his belief that Sadaam had WMD since it was the intellegence community that provided the information. Yes, the CIA, MI5 and numerous other agencies were wrong. But they were the ones who provided the information.

As to the nation being at a turning point? No, I don't think so. JMHO. But I doubt that most people even care or are aware of what is going on. Sad fact, but likely true.

 

[Dargo]

Re: "When a government takes the country to war on lies and misinformation,"

You know, maybe I'm the only one thinking this but, if you gave me basically unlimited funds and several years, I could most certainly hide and get rid of most all evidence of WMD. If you recall, inspections did not occur for years before this ordeal. Why doesn't anyone think that Iraq couldn't have disposed of, hidden, or moved out of the country, WMD?! Given the time, the funds and all the resources, I have no doubt I could have gotten rid of all evidence. I honestly don't see why nobody considers this a possibility. If you don't think he could do this, you have to ask why we have not been able to find Bin Laden in several years of trying. I just think that the fact remains that it is easier to hide and hide things when given the funds and people resources they have.