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Snowmaster #1656 rebuild

C

Cloudberry

New member
I am just now beginning the process if rebuilding my snowmaster. The major reason for doing this now is that the second VW motor blew up in a foot of overflow at -29F. This all happened on Lake Louise, Glennallen AK.

My plan is to replace the VW motor with an EJ25 Subaru motor. I have one, the old motor is out, and I’m making a list of things to do while the engine bay is empty.

Is there someone out there who has been down this road? I’d love to hear the issues encountered such as motor mount construction, brake replacement, and any other relevant experience. I haven’t been able to find anyone near Eagle River to commiserate with so here I am!

What do you think?
 
Yes. I have hung an ej18 in- place of a 1776cc air cooled. I did it In a st4. My professional opinion is if the swedes had this motor readily available in 1958 they would have been in every anowtrac made.

I recently inquired with kennedy engine adapters for another flywheel and adapter ans was surprised to find a short lead time.

Brakes are over rated. I do like the disc brake conversions but hydraulic e brakes are not the best idea.
 
Thanks for picking up my thread. I have adapter hardware coming from Kennedy. They have been very professional and I’m looking forward to working with them.

I think I agree with you on the brakes. My plan at the moment is to pull them apart, recondition them as much as possible and call it good. If you happen to have info on parts sources that would be nice but I think I can find enough to make it work!

My big issue at there moment is getting a wiring harness and ecu to get the ej25 running. I have started a conversation with Jeff at AV Subaru Conversions in Wisconsin for the harness. He seems feet knowledgeable and I hope for success there soon.

Also thinking about exhaust pipe routing and how it’s all going to fit. I’m in what I call the disaster phase of the project which has always passed one the hands get greasy enough. At any rate I’m at th e beginning and the winters are long here so I’m looking forward to it! The rig is in really pretty good shape overall!

The short video is proof the thing can work!
Thanks again!
 

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  • IMG_0878.mov
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Another question: with an output roughly 4x that of the original VW engine, what are your thoughts about overpowering the trans axle? Oh, and I agree with you that the Swedes would have used Subaru engines. That little VW just has to work too hard, and can’t get enough cooling air at typical speeds. Good engine, wrong application for sure.
 
The power is applied directly to both tracks just as ot would be in a sand rail or desert racing chassis. The vw trans axles in the torc off road racing association are putting large v8 torque and horsepower numbers through the transaxles.

The variater belt sees very little actual power.

Forum user lyndon documented variator operation quite well a threain call its a surprise.

Do a youtube search for a snow trac ecotech and you should find forum user louis getting after a very stout ecotech powered st4.
 
redsqwrl said:
The power is applied directly to both tracks just as ot would be in a sand rail or desert racing chassis. The vw trans axles in the torc off road racing association are putting large v8 torque and horsepower numbers through the transaxles.

The variater belt sees very little actual power.

Forum user lyndon documented variator operation quite well a threain call its a surprise.

Do a youtube search for a snow trac ecotech and you should find forum user louis getting after a very stout ecotech powered st4.
Click to expand...
 
I’m just wondering if any one might have stopped rotation of the break assembly (with the skid pan removed) by installing a member between the horn on the brake and the cross member toward the rear? The skid pan probably works fine but has always struck me as an after thought.
 
I used a torque reaction bar onto a heavy duty front bumper, worked very well
20201211_120252.jpg
 
I have a robust 2”x3” steel bumper and thought that would support the same thing. I plan to put a small winch on there at some point. Thanks for the confirmation.
 
I
Puckle said:
I used a torque reaction bar onto a heavy duty front bumper, worked very well
View attachment 198259
Click to expand...
I am very interested in the disk brake setup shown in your photo. What did you use and what sort of mods were necessary? The old drum brakes on mine seem to be in pretty good shape but I’d prefer calipers if the conversion is reasonable. Your photo is very helpful.
 
They are Mk 4 golf rear discs and calipers with the disc bolted to the drive sprocket after the drum had rivets drilled out and removed - details in my resto thread "ST4 back from the dead" here https://www.forumsforums.com/threads/st4-back-from-the-dead.86198/
I know brakes are not used much anyway but this was a way to use a descent handbrake for an emergency steering system as when I bought it my snow-trac had one of the variator shafts broken - something impossible to fix in the field but could be driven back if you could steer it
 
Puckle said:
They are Mk 4 golf rear discs and calipers with the disc bolted to the drive sprocket after the drum had rivets drilled out and removed - details in my resto thread "ST4 back from the dead" here https://www.forumsforums.com/threads/st4-back-from-the-dead.86198/
I know brakes are not used much anyway but this was a way to use a descent handbrake for an emergency steering system as when I bought it my snow-trac had one of the variator shafts broken - something impossible to fix in the field but could be driven back if you could steer it
Click to expand...
Very helpful, thanks!!
 
I’m trying to confirm the correct clutch and pressure plate to use. I no longer have the original clutch assembly but I think it was the old style based on the throwout bearing. Can someone confirm or refute this based on my photo of the throwout bearing and fork?
IMG_6507.jpeg
 
I have one out in the snow. I can try to get matching photos. ( t/o bearing and pressure plate) it wont be till tomorrow am.

Im usa central time zone
 
Well shit... i have never met anyone in alaska that wouldnt bust there ass either pulling nonrunning st4's out to the highway with a dozer... or running my fat ass back up that trail with a rokon to scavenge parts....

20251204_200908.jpg

This

20251204_200935.jpg

Mates to this

20251204_200945.jpg

In these. Its serial number is either 939 or 1131

1600 single port
 
I was up last May and the month of July the year previous....the sun really messes with me... i expect every store to be open because the sun is still up.
My people just went full tilt as if sleep wasnt needed!
 
When I first came here almost 40 years ago, I remember staggering out of some gin mill at 1am thinking about going fishing. Was still daylight, nobody else around, air nice and cool….. why not!!

I’ve got another question. The trans axle I’m dealing with appears to be an early style. I think this because the throwout bearing is just clipped to the fork. The question, however, is regarding the 12v starter. It isn’t a VW starter as far as I can tell, and looks like it might be a Lucas product (partial tag that’s hard to read. It fits concentrically in the bell housing as expected but one of what appears to be a factory cast bolt hole (lower one when mounted) is not used. Instead, a new hole has been located in built up (welded) aluminum. I’m wondering if this is commonly done or if I could just replace my starter with a 12v VW unit. Somebody once said the solenoid conflicts with the variator but it doesn’t appear to me that it would. Since the starter mounts concentric to the pilot bearing, the mounting holes in the VW bell housing must sit at some angle other than 180 degrees to the shaft. I’m thinking I could just use a regular 12v VW starter…. Why not?

Seems a puzzle to me, but being half Norwegian and half Swedish, it’s par for the course. Uff Da!
 
Cloudberry said:
It isn’t a VW starter as far as I can tell, and looks like it might be a Lucas product (partial tag that’s hard to read. It fits concentrically in the bell housing as expected but one of what appears to be a factory cast bolt hole (lower one when mounted) is not used. Instead, a new hole has been located in built up (welded) aluminum. I’m wondering if this is commonly done or if I could just replace my starter with a 12v VW unit. Somebody once said the solenoid conflicts with the variator but it doesn’t appear to me that it would. Since the starter mounts concentric to the pilot bearing, the mounting holes in the VW bell housing must sit at some angle other than 180 degrees to the shaft. I’m thinking I could just use a regular 12v VW starter…. Why not?

Seems a puzzle to me, but being half Norwegian and half Swedish, it’s par for the course. Uff Da!
Click to expand...
The stock vw starter won't align properly and you can only get one bolt. The other side was held by a tabbed L shaped bracket that clamped the starter housing in position. There is a couple of gear reduction starters available that allow you to rotate the starter body (multiple mounting positions by rotating the mount) to clear the variator shaft. It is the solenoid that is the issue with clearance, not the starter motor.
 
Cloudberry said:
When I first came here almost 40 years ago, I remember staggering out of some gin mill at 1am thinking about going fishing. Was still daylight, nobody else around, air nice and cool….. why not!!

I’ve got another question. The trans axle I’m dealing with appears to be an early style. I think this because the throwout bearing is just clipped to the fork. The question, however, is regarding the 12v starter. It isn’t a VW starter as far as I can tell, and looks like it might be a Lucas product (partial tag that’s hard to read. It fits concentrically in the bell housing as expected but one of what appears to be a factory cast bolt hole (lower one when mounted) is not used. Instead, a new hole has been located in built up (welded) aluminum. I’m wondering if this is commonly done or if I could just replace my starter with a 12v VW unit. Somebody once said the solenoid conflicts with the variator but it doesn’t appear to me that it would. Since the starter mounts concentric to the pilot bearing, the mounting holes in the VW bell housing must sit at some angle other than 180 degrees to the shaft. I’m thinking I could just use a regular 12v VW starter…. Why not?

Seems a puzzle to me, but being half Norwegian and half Swedish, it’s par for the course. Uff Da!
Click to expand...

Cidertom said:
The stock vw starter won't align properly and you can only get one bolt. The other side was held by a tabbed L shaped bracket that clamped the starter housing in position. There is a couple of gear reduction starters available that allow you to rotate the starter body (multiple mounting positions by rotating the mount) to clear the variator shaft. It is the solenoid that is the issue with clearance, not the starter motor.
Click to expand...
Very helpful, thank you! I’ll look around for what’s available. Any recommendation on source? I’m thinking Jbugs might be a good place to start. The old setup has worked fine so I’ll probably keep it for now!! Thanks!
 
6v and 12v bushings are different. Easiest to change while its apart.
I use auto stick starters with lil angle iron brackets. No bushing at all.

You hit it on the head why change what works
 
The squirrel has a point. I have no direct experience. If I have to replace my starter it will be a WOSP gear reduction (jbugs and other sources) From discussions the gear reduction starters pull less current than standard starters. And I have been told that if you go with a higher compression engine they are almost a must.
 
Cidertom said:
The squirrel has a point. I have no direct experience. If I have to replace my starter it will be a WOSP gear reduction (jbugs and other sources) From discussions the gear reduction starters pull less current than standard starters. And I have been told that if you go with a higher compression engine they are almost a must.
Click to expand...
Sounds good! Anybody got a photo of one such in place? Pretty tight quarters in there and the starters look pretty bulky (without any scale reference). I’m worried about this mostly because I’m just idling waiting for other parts to arrive !!! Thanks!
 
The WOSP starter is code LMS027-11 but you need to check you have 12v flywheel - 130 teeth as opposed to 6v flywheel which has 109 teeth. You dont need to worry about the bush as the geared starters don't use it.
20201113_143433.jpg
 
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