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  #1  
Old 01-24-2017, 12:20 PM
oilline oilline is offline
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Default Variator Wear ??

Hello. New to the forum and just bought a Snowtrac ST 4 #2317.
Just having a look over it and on the right hand variator pulley there has been some wear on a linkage shaft . Any idea whats causing this
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Old 01-24-2017, 05:01 PM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

check st25 and see if it is broke. it is that large aluminum piece in the center.
are the rub marks fresh?
jim
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Old 01-24-2017, 05:10 PM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

Better check the bearings in the variator tower - lack of lube?
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Old 01-24-2017, 06:30 PM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

Here is a photo of the ST-25 part in the variator. They sometimes break. If yours is broken, then I'm in the process of having some new ones made. Should hopefully be done this winter..
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Old 01-24-2017, 06:49 PM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

I'd check the variator bearings. See post: http://www.forumsforums.com/3_9/showthread.php?t=67338 for some pix of what to expect.
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Old 01-25-2017, 03:32 AM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

Are these things easy to take apart? Anything to watch out for? Can i disassemble the offending assembly with the engine and transmission in place. I would like to take off the pulley assembly and feel for play in the vertical shaft bearings.
Also will look at ST-25.
Also is it safe to raise the cat on axle stands on the chassis so i can run the trackes and turn the steering to try and see whats going on?
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Old 01-25-2017, 07:48 AM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

Do you have a parts manual with the exploded views of how this goes together?? You should get one. To do as you wish, the engine and trans stay in place. I suspect the top bearings in the left hand tower... It could be old damage, and the bearings replaced by a previous owner..

Yes you can put the cat on stands and run the tracks. This is how you set the variator center, so the machine will track straight with the steering wheel in the center of it's range of movement...

There is tons of information here on this forum. The search feature is your friend. Use it, but if you need help, lots of us are here for that to.

Regards, Kirk
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Old 01-25-2017, 08:26 AM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

Another shot. Does this look correct? I presume the splines are see are the vertical shaft, are they visible because the pulley is pushed down at the moment?
It looks like fresh wear to me, the grease is impregnated with metal filings

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Old 01-25-2017, 09:19 AM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

your steering drops it like that when you turn. the other pulley top comes off to take it apart. take some good pictures if you don't notice the broken part. I would suspect the variator shifted .
if it is the up right off the transaxle check the mounting bolts to it that are on the very bottom on the axle. they have been known to work loose. you may want to look at that first before tearing the varator apart.
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Last edited by JimVT; 01-25-2017 at 09:38 AM.
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Old 01-25-2017, 10:05 AM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by oilline View Post
Are these things easy to take apart? Anything to watch out for? Can i disassemble the offending assembly with the engine and transmission in place. I would like to take off the pulley assembly and feel for play in the vertical shaft bearings.
Also will look at ST-25.
Also is it safe to raise the cat on axle stands on the chassis so i can run the trackes and turn the steering to try and see whats going on?
Easy depends on how the pins are that hold the arms. Mine were rust frozen and it took a bit to free them. Once free the variator came apart fairly easily. I wound up replacing the pins and making new bushings.

On running on stands. Make certain the track is tensioned correctly and is well free of the stands.
or
in place of running on stands, you can remove the drive chains. Should be a clip link.
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Old 01-25-2017, 02:16 PM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

http://www.forumsforums.com/3_9/atta...1&d=1147362792
Where ST11A (the "tower" casting that houses the vertical shaft) mates to the Horizontal casting, ST10, there are 3 studs. Each has a Grade 8 nut. For it to wear like this: 1)The hardware has loosened, the most common scenario, 2) One or more of the studs have broken off, 3) a mounting 'ear' is broken.
You will not have to remove the engine or Variator to tighten it up if that is the problem, but you will have to remove some of the stuff that prohibits access.
Remove the air induction horn, and the big Belt as per the previous instructions. Try not to get the belt greasy. They are usually 13 or 14 MM. The studs themselves are not hardened. Don't torque them down too much, they can be pulled right out of the ST10 housing.
Also, check all the bushings for the 1/2 roll pins. One of those could be giving trouble.
The steel "H" frame of the variator usually ties the two towers together, but I have seen many machines that the hardware for this is loose. It tends to chew out the holes in the alloy at the top of ST11A. You will have to remove all 4 "Chives" (Pulley-halves) to inspect this.
Your machine is very near the end of Swedish production. I looked at ST4#2311 in Maine at the US importer's place, and 2318 in the Yukon Territory. Good luck with it.
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Old 01-25-2017, 03:45 PM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

I second what Lyndon said
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Old 01-25-2017, 04:52 PM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyndon View Post
http://www.forumsforums.com/3_9/atta...1&d=1147362792
Where ST11A (the "tower" casting that houses the vertical shaft) mates to the Horizontal casting, ST10, there are 3 studs. Each has a Grade 8 nut. For it to wear like this: 1)The hardware has loosened, the most common scenario, 2) One or more of the studs have broken off, 3) a mounting 'ear' is broken.
You will not have to remove the engine or Variator to tighten it up if that is the problem, but you will have to remove some of the stuff that prohibits access.
Remove the air induction horn, and the big Belt as per the previous instructions. Try not to get the belt greasy. They are usually 13 or 14 MM. The studs themselves are not hardened. Don't torque them down too much, they can be pulled right out of the ST10 housing.
Also, check all the bushings for the 1/2 roll pins. One of those could be giving trouble.
The steel "H" frame of the variator usually ties the two towers together, but I have seen many machines that the hardware for this is loose. It tends to chew out the holes in the alloy at the top of ST11A. You will have to remove all 4 "Chives" (Pulley-halves) to inspect this.
Your machine is very near the end of Swedish production. I looked at ST4#2311 in Maine at the US importer's place, and 2318 in the Yukon Territory. Good luck with it.
What do you mean by the "bushings for the 1/2 roll pins". Is it ST3007 and St 3014
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Old 01-27-2017, 10:23 PM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by oilline View Post
What do you mean by the "bushings for the 1/2 roll pins". Is it ST3007 and St 3014
3014. Those are the ones I had issues with. the pins were frozen to them, and they were the rotating member, which made the holes in the arms egg shaped. If you look at the pix in my above mentioned post you will see what I turned out of bearing bronze to replace them.

I'm not certain those (by themselves) could give you that much play. I would lean to the bearings. My big issue was the other variator. With the wear I had on it, on the drivers side you could get the wear you saw. I wound up turning new bearing holders, and replacing the sheave half.

Welcome to the YTPS (You're The Parts Store) repair methods.

Also for what it's worth: My trac, #2116 all of the above and the bolts were Metric, not SAE. I don't know when the change happened, but almost all of the stuff under the hood, not just the VW, on mine is metric.

CT
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Old 01-28-2017, 12:16 AM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

That is a LOT of lateral movement. I would check the bolt on the drivers end of the ST7020 to ST11A as well, and the bottom bolts of the ST25, there is so much misalignment I am surprised your machine steers well.
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Old 01-28-2017, 04:10 AM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

Lots of good information there . I hope to investigate this weekend.
Thanks everybody
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Old 01-28-2017, 08:30 AM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

if you give your location one of us could live nearby.
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Old 01-28-2017, 08:55 AM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimVT View Post
if you give your location one of us could live nearby.
Ha ! I wish ! Im in the UK
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Old 01-28-2017, 11:54 AM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

Well i have found the culprit


Top bearing completely knackered. Dont know where all the balls have gone ! Tapped hole in ST11A broke away.


So what to do? Obviousley the tower is going to need to be repaired. I should be able to get it welded up i hope. Can i get the tower off in situ? Im struggling to get a socket on to the rear and side bolt due to the diameter of the socket fouling on the diameter of ST11A.

Do you think it wise to pull the transmission and strip to find the balls and any other fragments from the collapsed bearing?

Is the top bearing a standard part? What about the bearing cap, ST13A? Is that available or am i going to have to make one?
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Old 01-28-2017, 01:41 PM
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Default Re: Variator Wear ??

You could try to contact Nick Kirk. He's in the UK and just bought himself a Snow Trac. I know he looked at several before he bought one and I think he mentioned one that was broken for parts... Might know where you can find the items you need.
Here is his facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/nick.kirk.773?ref=ts&fref=ts
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