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Member with Lowest serial number?

snotrans

Member
Regarding the interest in early snowcat production, I have found in my library and would be willing to share this 155 page historical comparison of over the snow vehicles, called Over The Snow Vehicles. It is a copy of a 1955 Master of Science Thesis in Industrial Education from a western university. A great amount of historical research and pertinent technical data has been documented from 1939 to 1954 within this publication. Their intent was to make a comparative analysis of the vehicles produced by these research projects and to relate what was being done in the field of over the snow transport. This historical information was compiled from field diaries, periodical reports, personal interviews from engineers, techs and agencies, such as US Geological Surveys, Soil Conservation Snow Surveys, Utah Scientific Research Foundation, Bell Telephone and others. This comparative data shows important performance and design features of many vehicles, such as Hansen, Barrett, Frandee, Eskelson, St. Bernard, Frandee Sea Wolf ( this is the plate of the machine of which Lyndon speaks and has given to me, model 4GX, Serial # 1 and is pictured above in this same forum topic), military T27, M27, Tucker Snocat, propellar driven snow planes, converted tractor snowmobiles and early Bombardiers. This publication contains many photo's and lots of factual information about the many early manufactures within the snowcat industry. Copies are available for $120.00 (includes postage). Contact Mary, snotrans@msn.com
 

Mainer

Boggie likes our museum
SUPER Site Supporter
Now Mainer, before you get "dibs" on anymore machines I really think you oughta start work on at least one of your fleet. Otherwise all these cool machines are just gonna be rotting away in "Mainer's Trackmaster Junkyard" until some day your widow will be selling them off for scrap.

OK, ok, you're speaking logically and I often listen to logic ... but... wait... logic doesn't apply to eccentric passions and obsessions! The little orange snowcat devil on my shoulder keeps wispering in my ear... more...More! MORE! M-O-R-E !!!

But still... you're right ... someone else go dig her up. Only the most obsessive will attempt it and the most crazy will succeed! :bonk: If no one has done so in a year then I'll give it a go if Lyndon is still game.

But as to rotting... not a chance... each is in a "catcoon" (www.carcoon.com) and each kitty is up on jack stands with a track rotator that keeps most track parts moving... rotates at 1 inch per hour.
 

couchloafer

Member
SUPER Site Supporter
Regarding the interest in early snowcat production, I have found in my library and would be willing to share this 155 page historical comparison of over the snow vehicles, called Over The Snow Vehicles. It is a copy of a 1955 Master of Science Thesis in Industrial Education from a western university. A great amount of historical research and pertinent technical data has been documented from 1939 to 1954 within this publication. Their intent was to make a comparative analysis of the vehicles produced by these research projects and to relate what was being done in the field of over the snow transport. This historical information was compiled from field diaries, periodical reports, personal interviews from engineers, techs and agencies, such as US Geological Surveys, Soil Conservation Snow Surveys, Utah Scientific Research Foundation, Bell Telephone and others. This comparative data shows important performance and design features of many vehicles, such as Hansen, Barrett, Frandee, Eskelson, St. Bernard, Frandee Sea Wolf ( this is the plate of the machine of which Lyndon speaks and has given to me, model 4GX, Serial # 1 and is pictured above in this same forum topic), military T27, M27, Tucker Snocat, propellar driven snow planes, converted tractor snowmobiles and early Bombardiers. This publication contains many photo's and lots of factual information about the many early manufactures within the snowcat industry. Copies are available for $120.00 (includes postage). Contact Mary, snotrans@msn.com

I stopped by Snotrans 2 weeks ago and Bill made me copies of a few pages of this manual...... what a cool manual...... It talks about the first Thiokols. I will post what I have. Bill is in the process of rebuilting a Frandee SnoShu Model E #40 ( rumor has it that this particular snow cat fell off of a trailer and was abandoned beside the road. If I am remembering what Bill told me correctly he picked it up for the impound and storage fee.). This model may predate the Frandee Sea Wolf #1 listed earlier in this thread. You will have to click on this link to view the pdf, I couldn't get it to post here. http://www.forumsforums.com/pp53/data/593/Frandee_SnoShu_and_Sea_Wolf.pdf

Thanks to teledawg for making the pdf for us..... I think I may have provided the wrong website to Bill Guthrie's business. The proper address is http://www.snotrans.com/
 

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couchloafer

Member
SUPER Site Supporter
For you Thiokol guys and gals out there I highly recommend a copy of this manual. Here are more pictures of #40
 

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Thiokol2track

Bronze Member
SUPER Site Supporter
Couchloafer, That is very cool!!:thumb: Thanks for sharing the photos and info. I hope to get out to visit Bill's place some day too. It must be like snowcat heaven.Did Bill say what the bolts between the cleats were for?? They dont look long enough for traction, but to long for something to be bolted on with.:unsure:
 

Bobcat

Je Suis Charlie Hebdo
GOLD Site Supporter
The cleats look just like Kristi cleats...or vice-versa.
 

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NorthernRedneck

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
You're right Bob, they do look like they are make out of toothpicks and bubblegum.











Just kidding. I'm still amazed those wooden cleets last as long as they do.
 

couchloafer

Member
SUPER Site Supporter
The cleats look just like Kristi cleats...or vice-versa.
I dont know very much about the Krustys but I am sure they were not in existance in the early 1950's ........in fact I understand they may have not been conceived at all had it not been for a bad acid trip in the 1960's :w00t2: :w00t2::bounce: :w00t2: :w00t2:
 

couchloafer

Member
SUPER Site Supporter
Any collectors out there?


Snow Cat for sale - $6500 (Soda Springs)

http://eastidaho.craigslist.org/rvs/974013549.html
Up for sale is a Frandee Snoshu. Model number: B Serial number: 7. I was told when I purchased this that it was a 1963 model. The cool thing about this little contraption is that it is composed of all automotive parts. No specialty parts. It has a Ford inline 6 cylnder engine and a 4 speed transmission. It runs and motors around good. Probably going to need new tires, and some interior work. It will seat 6 adults comfortably, it has 2 heaters, it seems to operate well, etc. Asking $6500 or OBO. If interested please fill free to contact me at: (208)547-7297 after 6:30 pm.
 

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Snowcat Operations

Active member
SUPER Site Supporter
I believe Bobcat has the oldest know two track snowcat in the world. Its sitting in my yard. Yes I am a VERY good friend........DMIESNER came by and saw the Kristi I have in my yard. He said...." Thats a Kristi in your yard? Man your a true friend to allow that to stay here!" LOL.
 

Bobcat

Je Suis Charlie Hebdo
GOLD Site Supporter
DMIESNER came by and saw the Kristi I have in my yard.

What year would that be Mike?

I'm pretty sure it was 2008. :rolleyes:


























Oh, the snowcat? :mrgreen: I'm not so sure it's the oldest 2-track, but it's a '57. There's another in the works that is probably older, but won't now the year till I get me mitts on it.
 

Snowcat Operations

Active member
SUPER Site Supporter
I'm pretty sure it was 2008. :rolleyes: quote]
I'm pretty sure it was 2008. :rolleyes:





UH Bob he was asking what year your KRISTI was made......:mellow:......:yum:

Couchloafer I believe it was 1956. Bob will know. BUT Bob has since located 2 cats called Bear cats?? I think that was what Bob told me. One is a VW rebody. The other is supposed to look like an airplane body and still runs! Its supposed to be older than the KRISTI he has now! At least one will be joining Bobs growing fleets of Kristis and I guess now he will also be known as a bear cat company collector? Better than known as just a Kristi Collector! I Havent even heard of them but if it looks like an airplane then its gotta be cool!
 
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Lyndon

Bronze Member
GOLD Site Supporter
HOT TIPS ON LACATING THE OLDEST SNOW-CAT
I see that the Serian #7 Frandie Sea Wolf is on E-Bay right now. It's the white one pictured elsewhere on the FF.
Anyone live anywhere near Calispel? One of our mechanics here in Prudhoe just told me about some ancient track car sitting in REA's yard there. I asked him to get pic's on his next R & R.
When I started searching/collecting antique Snow Cats, first I called every Ski Area. That was a BUST. Next I started calling Power and Phone Companies, with some limited results. Where I really started to hit "Pay-Dirt" was with Bill Guthrie in Idaho, and with the manufacturers and Dealers. Later I had a suprising amount of success with Electric Motor Rewind Shops. They always had some 70 year old 'Duffer' that knew everything and everybody for a hundred miles around. At times I was spending 300$ a month on phone bills.
But for all my efforts it is likely that I only located 1/100 of what's out there in the US, and less than that amount of what's in Canada. One in perticular Small Vintage Snow Cat I would consider highly 'collectable' would be a Bombardier B7. They look like shortened up versions of the B12 Snow Coach, but from checking records at Bombardier, it would appear that only about 130 were produced, 1937-1940.
Do we have a member at the FF that has one?
 

PrecisionMarine

New member
I've been reading a lot of these old posts about the very early Utah Scientific Research Foundation and Thiokol. Noticed the 'Patent Pending' on snotrans' #40 tag, and dug a little... Google has a patent search function. There is very detailed info on what looks like the very first one- "Scandie Sea Wolf", from March 1959.
USRF seems to have a LOT of patent apps, so I've just started digging..

http://www.google.com/patents?id=LmZiAAAAEBAJ&pg=PA1&dq=Utah+Scientific+Research&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=2#v=onepage&q=Utah%20Scientific%20Research&f=false
 

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PrecisionMarine

New member
A couple more, including some early attempts at over-snow transport, Tuckers, and Schomer's patent for the Kristi.
 

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Lyndon

Bronze Member
GOLD Site Supporter
That's definately the machine I pulled the serial number plate off.
Here's some pic's from another thread.
cam4boys1957.jpg

snocat1957.jpg
 

PrecisionMarine

New member
Thanks Lyndon, it's an interesting design.. good to be able trace the Thiokols back to infancy. I read your earlier postings about this machine, too bad all that remains is the serial number plate, photos and memories.
Maybe the wrong time of year, but I was hoping to spark someone's interest in building a repro... looks like about everything but the body, frame and tracks were stock components from 40's trucks.
http://www.forumsforums.com/3_9/showthread.php?p=462338#post462338
 

Helmsman38

Member Formerly Known As Kristi KT7
GOLD Site Supporter
Thiokol 1402 imp 1964 serial number 027
 

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the old trucker

New member
But for all my efforts it is likely that I only located 1/100 of what's out there in the US, and less than that amount of what's in Canada. One in perticular Small Vintage Snow Cat I would consider highly 'collectable' would be a Bombardier B7. They look like shortened up versions of the B12 Snow Coach, but from checking records at Bombardier, it would appear that only about 130 were produced, 1937-1940.
Do we have a member at the FF that has one?[/QUOTE]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Looks like this one could make 131. Here is a B-7 being built from scratch by a gentleman that worked side by side with Bombardier himself, building the B12 & B-7's. And this frame is for sale....

IMGP3369.jpg
 

FiremanDan13

New member
Have you Thyokol 'Guy's' determined who in your groop has the oldest, lowest serial number machine? I see in "Deep Powder Project", that the Imp has a number in the 600's making it a very early production machine.
I have 4 Thiokol Snow cats my latest acquisition is a very early 4VL Serial # GSA 33….
I have a Thiokol Spryte and 2 Thiokol T10s
I hope the GSA 33 is the lowest I need to get or rebuild my tracks on the 4VL
 

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FiremanDan13

New member
Have you Thyokol 'Guy's' determined who in your groop has the oldest, lowest serial number machine? I see in "Deep Powder Project", that the Imp has a number in the 600's making it a very early production machine.
I have 4 Thiokol Snow cats my latest acquisition is a very early 4VL Serial #
 

Idaho IMP

Member
What year would a 1404 with serial number 673 be... Approximately
Howdy! i have 1404 no. 669. Mine was delivered to the USFS in Washington 1972. I would assume yours is a 72 as well.
if you contact Dan Gates, Snowcat Service in Salt Lake, he can supply a PDF of your original build sheet. It’s good info to have. Are you a full cab or 2 seater?

Welcome to the club, it’s a great place!
 
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