Duh.... where is the oil money???

I was told by a friend that lives in Alaska, that every resident gets a share of the oil revenue that comes to them once a year as a check from the State of Alaska....
I just read this in the news, and I am wondering why Alaska feels a need to tap the Federal Government for the Stimulus Package money....

The 2008 GOP vice presidential nominee, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, scheduled meetings in Washington this weekend with Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky and other senators to press for her state's share of the package.

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It the state government of Alaska has enough money to send it back to all the residents in the form or a check, then why do they need to take from the other states that need this money more?????

I walk into your classroom with a big bowl of candy. There's children from poor to well to do family's in the room. Should the children from well to family's receive none or less so the poor ones can have more. That would not be fair at all would it. There's also going to be the same unfair feeling if they should distribute all the candy in big metro areas leaving rural Americans without any candy. It's going to be interesting to watch and see how they can distribute all this free candy fairly.

If when you walk in there, the wealth kids have bowls full of candy, and the poor one's bowls are empty. Are you going to fill the poor ones bowls, and then fill the wealth kids bowls till they are overflowing? Remember, we are talking about taxpayer money here, not candy. Personally, I don't like the "stimulus" package at all, since it is loaded with pork barrel politics. However, if it is going to be given, it should be at least given where the need is the greatest.

Well were is the need greatest then. Give it irresponsible states who spent themselves into a huge hole. That's no better than giving it to wall street exc's. which will probably end up with most of it anyway. There's nothing in fair to reward irresponsibility by rewarding them more money to repeat past irresponsibility. What's going to be fair to in this housing crisis going on now. A lot of people bought more house than they could afford. And borrowed every penny they could grasp a hold of. Their talking like forgiving debt to these people for there actions. This ain't right at all in any way. It's like kicking the good hardworking American worker in the teeth. The one who struggled and saved to pay for the American dream. The ones who went home and ate beans and hotdogs to save their cash for there home or new car they desired or wanted. Instead they want to bail out the irresponsible individuals who ate at Applebee's 4 night's a week going through money like the Rockfeller's they are pretending to be. No there ain't nothing in this mess that's going to be fair at all I'm afraid.

The PFD (Permanent Fund Dividend) you refer to is not that much in most years, and this next will be pretty small due to the stock market drop.

Alaska covers almost as much area as a third of the lower 48 States, has 43,000 miles of Coastline, millions of Lakes and has less than 600,000+- people for a population. Only about 2% of the State land is in private ownership, the rest is Federal, State or Native Corp lands that has been transfered to to National Parks, State Parks, Wetlands, Wildlife Preserves, Moose Preserves and the list goes on.

Our Road system is less that what the smaller States have, our National Highways are about a total of 1500 miles or less.

The state of Alaska does not get much money from it's people because there isn't many to start with to pay. But the required Federal levels of whatever regulations that are being enforced are mandated by the Feds, and they have to fund most of those projects.

The military is the biggest source of Federal income to the State, it is also the closest State to where the military should be in world events since it it the "Top Cover" of America. The military bases in the lower 48 states were mostly to protect the early settlers from Indian Attacks that have long since disappeared. All missile launches from the Mideast, Russia, China and most of the rest of the World aimed at the US, will pass over Alaska and Canada (something about the way the earth rotates) so the missile defense is a big cost here too.

Alaska's cost from the Russian's was about 2 cents an acre when they bought it, the money Alaska has generated in return to the US has repaid itself thousands of times over in Federal Taxes on Fishing, Early Fur trade, Mining, Oil, Gas (about ten+- percent of the Nation's fuel over the last thirty years has come from Alaska).

Over all, the money that the Feds pay "To" Alaska is but a small percentage of what they "Take" from Alaska. You figure that the money they make off the oil taxes at the pump alone from Alaskan Oil itself will pay for much of the out of state road system a couple of times over. Not very many States put at much per person back into the Federal Coffers as Alaska does from other sources other than Federal Income Tax.

Nope, our Governor Palin should be right there at the front of the line with the rest of the Governor's.

fogtender said:

The PFD (Permanent Fund Dividend) you refer to is not that much in most years, and this next will be pretty small due to the stock market drop.

Alaska covers almost as much area as a third of the lower 48 States, has 43,000 miles of Coastline, millions of Lakes and has less than 600,000+- people for a population. Only about 2% of the State land is in private ownership, the rest is Federal, State or Native Corp lands that has been transfered to to National Parks, State Parks, Wetlands, Wildlife Preserves, Moose Preserves and the list goes on.

Our Road system is less that what the smaller States have, our National Highways are about a total of 1500 miles or less.

The state of Alaska does not get much money from it's people because there isn't many to start with to pay. But the required Federal levels of whatever regulations that are being enforced are mandated by the Feds, and they have to fund most of those projects.

The military is the biggest source of Federal income to the State, it is also the closest State to where the military should be in world events since it it the "Top Cover" of America. The military bases in the lower 48 states were mostly to protect the early settlers from Indian Attacks that have long since disappeared. All missile launches from the Mideast, Russia, China and most of the rest of the World aimed at the US, will pass over Alaska and Canada (something about the way the earth rotates) so the missile defense is a big cost here too.

Alaska's cost from the Russian's was about 2 cents an acre when they bought it, the money Alaska has generated in return to the US has repaid itself thousands of times over in Federal Taxes on Fishing, Early Fur trade, Mining, Oil, Gas (about ten+- percent of the Nation's fuel over the last thirty years has come from Alaska).

Over all, the money that the Feds pay "To" Alaska is but a small percentage of what they "Take" from Alaska. You figure that the money they make off the oil taxes at the pump alone from Alaskan Oil itself will pay for much of the out of state road system a couple of times over. Not very many States put at much per person back into the Federal Coffers as Alaska does from other sources other than Federal Income Tax.

Nope, our Governor Palin should be right there at the front of the line with the rest of the Governor's.

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I was told that newborns of old residents who recieve money or new residents of Alaska do not get to share in the oil wealth ? Was I lied too ?

I believe that most Alaskan oil is sold to the Japanese. That's a good place to start.

The Tourist said:

I believe that most Alaskan oil is sold to the Japanese. That's a good place to start.

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When I was in the Coast Guard Stationed at the Port of Valdez inspecting oil Tankers when the oil flow first started in 1977, it wasn't to be sold overseas at first.

When Congress passed the "TAPS" act in 1973 stating the pipeline was going to be built in the name of National Security, the oil could only be sold to the US. But after about 1983 or so, they started to let it be sold overseas with the excuse that instead of shipping it to the East Coast, we could sell it to Japan and other Pacific Rim countries and buy oil from the Mideast to save shipping charges.

They figured that the more oil on the world market, the cheaper the oil I suppose.... they still tax the hell out of it though, going and coming...

BigAl said:

I was told that newborns of old residents who recieve money or new residents of Alaska do not get to share in the oil wealth ? Was I lied too ?

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Once the kid is a year old from Jan 1 to Dec 31 of that "Calender" year, they get the PFD. Same applies to new Residents, you have to be here a year from the same dates. Once residency has been established, if you are an Alaskan Resident in the military getting transfered elsewhere or a student going outside the state to school, you can still collect the PFD as long as you are still on active duty outside the state or in school.

But they are checking the list twice! Seems there are some unemployed elf's with such a bad Christmas this last year...

Most years, the PFD has been a few hundred dollars, this last one was a lark and will be back to a small amount again shortly.

People move here thinking they are going to be able to live off the PFD, but are sadly mistaken, a couple of thousand dollars for a big family don't go very far.

fogtender said:

People move here thinking they are going to be able to live off the PFD, but are sadly mistaken, a couple of thousand dollars for a big family don't go very far.

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Man was I way off . I thought it was close to $6000 a person at one time !
OK I crossed Alaska off my "Move To" list

BigAl said:

Man was I way off . I thought it was close to $6000 a person at one time !
OK I crossed Alaska off my "Move To" list

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Your still welcome to come up and visit though, we can take you out in some real snowcats critters...

Do Native American Indians get more? I was talking with some Native American Indians in Alaska on a work related issue and it seems like they set the state amount was around $10,000.

k-dog said:

Do Native American Indians get more? I was talking with some Native American Indians in Alaska on a work related issue and it seems like they set the state amount was around $10,000.

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The Alaska Natives don't have "Reservations" like in the South per say, they have Native Corporations, and the money they get is dividends from the money their Corporations make, and some do very well. There is only one Reservation in southeast Alaska because that group didn't want to be a part of the Alaska Native Claims settlement act and they got what the southern Indians got, a reservation. Basically, they got the short end of the stick, but it is what they wanted at the time and the bus left the station.

So the short answer to your question is... NO, they don't get more from the PFD.

A lot are on welfare and other public aid for an assortment of reasons, mostly because they can. But that is an entirely different thread.

I think its 3700 and change, the PFD and the fuel oil credit together per person. For a family of 4 its a nice peice of change. We called it Permanent Fun! I used to live at mile 89 Richardson hwy about a mile from the big pipe.

Alaska is complicated. Blanket logic and Lower 48 reasoning just doesn't apply there. The feds run everything there. The federal government still hasn't awarded alaska its statehood grant of land. A foreign ship cannot load or unload cargo in any Alaskan port. All foreign ships must unload in Seattle and the cargo placed on American ships for delivery in Alaskan ports. The Alaska RailRoad was built by the gov and run for the use of the military until they didn't need it anymore. Then it was turned over to the State but never made a profit for decades the federal gov subsidizes the RR for national security reasons. Ketchican sometimes gets 50 ft. of snow in a single winter. I saw -60* winters in Copper Center. You just cant compare it to anywhere in the lower 48. My cousin went on the cat train that put the haul road thru to the Dew line stations on the north slope, Over 400 miles thru swamps and over the Brooks Range. That was back in the 60s. I worked on the Exxon Valdez Oil Spill. if you hurry maybe you can get in on the 40 Billion dollar natural gas PIPELINE theyre building NOW! It's FEAST or FAMINE in ALASKA and the RUSH IS ON ! Take plenty of mosquito reppelent and take it from me its easy if your tougher than everybody else! It's a great place to go if your Young and Strong but better pay attention mistakes eleminate too many people up there. You wouldn't expect to get trampled to death by a moose coming out the front door of the State University Library but it happened in Anchorage. Bears get a few every year. Sourdough is a term of respect up there. Mostly it means Survivor. I been over the AlCAN 5 times First time in 1972 it was an adventure......really!

When I moved to alaska I went in may and got there in june . I took my time one way or another. We didn't get a pfd till a year after our first October it was like 475$ for each person (babies have to have a SS#) That was 86, in 97 we used the 1750$ EACH TO MOVE BACK TO TEXAS! I cut wood and hauled water for 12 winters and 13 summers. I never planned to leave Alaska but after wintering over twelve times I just couldn't face another winter not too cold it was just going to be too DARK! You can live with the cold but you cant live without ENOUGH LIGHT! At least I can't. I love ALASKA always have since that first time. It's an AMAZING Place. Everything is giant size in ALASKA! It's a different WORLD! MAJESTIC is just not adequate to describe the RAW SPLENDOR that is ALASKA. It's brand new and its old and rotten! It's rock slides and moose in the road, it's parking in the road for thirty minutes while 10,000 caribou cross the road in front of you, it's waiting an hour for a dump truck to dump a load at the dump so you can dash to the other end while the bears are checking out what he left and hurriedly unload and get back in the truck before the bears get you. Gold mines, copper mines, the Sea Food Industry alone is worth fighting a war to keep. If you never been to Alaska I say Go Now if you can or in june if you can. Theres a 40 Billion dollar Pipeline abuilding and a volcano fixin to bust wide open. She's Wild and Wooly and aint never been curried below the knees! Glaciers are melting and rivers are raging. Theres places where new land is being uncovered that have been covered by ice for hundreds of thousands of years. I heard of a man that got caught with 45 foxes he shot off the Denali road. Some guys got caught shipping container loads of salmon they were illegally taking out of the Copper River. Back in the old days 4th street in Anchorage was a holy terror! Any time day or night a dozen bars and 2 dozen parties,fishermen,sailors (american and foreign) chinese cannery workers,Eskimos,Aleuts and any other kind of people you can think of all trying to get drunker or fight harder or raise hell louder till they pass out. Chasing the booms is no way to end up rich but if your there at the right time at the right place you might pick up a healthy stake. Bush jobs usually pay room and board and lots of hours. Fishing is percentage of the catch,construction is big bucks big jobs. Every town has squatters everywhere living in 10X12 shacks with snow machine or 4wheeler trails. If I was young again I'd go back and do it all again. One day I was working in the feild at my cousins homestead at Mile 89 and I felt a strange feeling come over me like someone was watching me. I looked behind me and was shocked by the view I saw! The wrangel mountains had decided to come over and hover over me! Mountains that the day before had seemed distant and indistinct were now startlingly near. The air was crystal clear and the clarity was amazing. I could see the trees and animals on the slopes of the mountains rivulets of water and even the birds. I just stopped and watched in awe for a long time. I knew I would never see it again and I wanted to see as much as I could. I saw buffalo and moose, bears and eagles. It was like God pulled back the curtain and let me see. I told my cousin about it and he gave me the wise look and said it was a tempurature inversion . I still think it was GOD showing off! " See Dennis you worm See what I can do" Weeelll I guess you all know how I feel about ALASKA now. It was tough and some would say it was a mistake but I think Alaska was a fit place for me to try and struggle to win and finally to give in. I wound up right here where I started. The place I couldn't wait to get away from IS NOW HOME SWEET HOME. Any way I don't have to cut wood or haul water. It's fixing to get light out and I'm tired. Peak Oil is a Myth concocted by the gov. Alaska is VAST and 6 tectonic plates converge there I heard. I believe there is an ocean of oil there . Why else would the gov keep it locked up so tight! What would giant discoveries of oil do for the ruling elite? Their plans don't seem to include Peace and Prosperity for the common man just a war that will be the end of wars. This one really will do it I think. Well JESUS is LORD I read the back of the BOOK and WE WIN!

brazospete, great insight and info. I would like to hear more about your Alaska adventures in a new thread sometime.....Reps also.....

Do a search for Anchorage Daily News it's full of info on Alaska. But sadly it omits lots of info about projects because most are done in secret and routinely denied existence until nearly completed by out of state contractors and labor. If you ever get to anchorage dont miss "THE BEAR" ! It's at the airport. See it first before going into the Bush! It will change your must see itinerary and the CALIBER of the security precautions you consider adequate!

brazospete said:

I think its 3700 and change, the PFD and the fuel oil credit together per person. For a family of 4 its a nice peice of change. We called it Permanent Fun! I used to live at mile 89 Richardson hwy about a mile from the big pipe.

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You lived up by "Serendipity" then?

thanks for sharing Brazo, sounds like a great place to visit. I have friends that are Native to Alaska, they loved it, but like you wanted the more civil life here.

fogtender said:

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You lived up by "Serendipity" then?

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We called it Sherm'sville or Willow lake. I never heard of Serendipity. I heard other people call it " The land that time forgot". We finally got electricity and telephone service in like 95. You can't see much from the road but there's a rabbit warren of roads and trails in there. Where are you located from the picture I guessed somewhere around lake louise?? My cousin T.O. Brooks has his homestead 1/2 mile off the hwy behind Pete and Bea Aquilar's place. How many times have the people of Alaska voted to move the capitol to Big Lake since I left? I think it was twice before I left.

brazospete said:

We called it Sherm'sville or Willow lake. I never heard of Serendipity. I heard other people call it " The land that time forgot". We finally got electricity and telephone service in like 95. You can't see much from the road but there's a rabbit warren of roads and trails in there. Where are you located from the picture I guessed somewhere around lake louise?? My cousin T.O. Brooks has his homestead 1/2 mile off the hwy behind Pete and Bea Aquilar's place. How many times have the people of Alaska voted to move the capitol to Big Lake since I left? I think it was twice before I left.

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After I thought about it, Serendipity is about ten miles farther south towards Valdez. A couple of gals had a small resturant/hotel there accross from a Gravel pit that they bought for a song before the pipeline started. They sold the Gravel rights for about a million dollars to the pipeline construction, and have since divided the land and sold it.

At one time I lived in Valdez and would go by there often and stop in for coffee. I now live North of Denali National Park by about thirty miles on the highway system which is a lot more remote that the area you were in, just has a highway go by it. We get the bears in the burn barrels, moose in the gardens and wolves trying to eat the dogs.

I flew over your area and landed in Copper Center in my plane often on the highway to have coffee with the late Jerry Poor that had the 76 gas station up on the hill just North of the town center. He had that blue flame coming out of the log cabin "Church"... he was the Rev of.... sorta...

Very pretty area, lots of snow on the Pass side, which was great for snowmachining and sking.

But in the big picture, I grew up here and have lived or worked all over the state. Don't have plans to live anywhere else...

Sourdough huh? Spent some time around tangle lakes (Man I can almost taste blueberry pancakes) Sure miss having 10 cases of copper river reds in the pantry and a el tigre settin in front of the house!

For a cheechako I been around Alaska, spent 2 summers and a winter in Kodiak shrimp fishing and a round trip on the inside passage around 72and 73 seen the island and the coast all the way to Astoria oregon and back to Kodiak. I was a travelin Son of a Gun 3 trips to Alaska on the Alcan,2 trips back to Texas over the years. I don't like to fly much. Spent a couple mos in Kenai,and quite a little spell in Big Lake. Alaska was always Awesome for me! I'm not easy to AWE but I think ALASKA'S got what it takes to make a statue say awe! IT does take your breath away sometimes,but the part I like is after that when it makes your heart feel bigger! I been up swede lake trail to the alphabet hills and I know right where Hogan's Hill is! Hunted moose and Caribou all over Denali even went sheep hunting at Chitina (what a fiasco that was) a day and a half climbing a road (to a gold mine)That we could have drove in an hour( blisters that went to the meat) only to get to the top just in time to see the sheep disappear over the next ridge over from where we were, lots of laughs! 1/2 a day down (it's a lot easier going down a 2 to 1 slope)anyway it cured my hunger for mutton!! I even decided to drive up to Prudhoe bay one day, loaded 2 barrels of gas and a syphoning hose,a months worth of grub and plenty of squitter juice and took off! I'd been to squarebanks a few times so I just filled up my barrels and set sail for the arctic ocean everything was fine,beautiful day,truck was an old toyota tuff as nails and running great! I felt great All systems were GO! I ate up a hundred miles of that beautiful well graded gravel road and it just kept going on and on. I met noone, I saw noone,the only living things I saw were voles (mice) and a very few small birds and swamps,mile after mile of swamps! Now I'm not usually a shrinking violet. I've walked the meanstreets in Chicago,Houston, L.A. Miami and Stamford Texas but I gotta confess THAT ROAD GOT ME! It happened all at once! I got to wondering what the H??? I was doing? Why was I risking my life and my kids future just to be able to say I PEED IN THE ARCTIC OCEAN! I was an idiot! I must have a brain tumor! I was turned around and headed south in less than a minute! Boy I felt like a great weight had been lifted off me! Where I had been running 40 mph going north I was running 70 going south! I blew thru Fairbanks without even stopping I had plenty of gas and lots of candy bars! I made it home late that night of course it was still light(it was summer). My wife was still up when I got there and met me at the door with a quizzical look. " I wasn't expecting you for days..What happened?" "Did you have trouble with the truck?" "Nope I realised I was peeing a little bit every time the truck hit a bump and decided I really don't give a shit about seeing Prudhoe bay!" I slept that night in my own bed and woke up feeling glad to be alive! Next time maybe I'll tell you about my trip down the Inside Passage. But I'm tired now and gotta go change a dirty diaper. Levi is a pill but I haven't got him housebroke yet! Fog tender do you live North or South of the Alaska Range? On the richardson Hwy? Near Delta or what? I still got a few freinds up there tho none of them keep in touch much. I bet lots of things are changed in 12 years. I got questions,queries and posers! What do YOU think the HAARP project is? How do You think they run that 5 story generator without fuel tanks or a pipeline? Inquiring minds want to KNOW! WHY did they change it to the High FreQuency Active Auroral Research Project???? Did you know they upped the output of that thing from 100,000 Watts to a BILLION WATTS. In your opinion have the auroral Lights been changed at all? I know the weather down here is doing flip flops from flood to droughtand from blistering hot to bone chilling cold with extreme Storms being the normal instead of the exception! Do you hear much about the Gas Pipeline? Is anybody hiring? Where are they shipping the Pipe from? Is it Hush really Hush Hush? Djew work on the oil spill? Oh Well... Tell me all your secrets and I'll tell you some of mine. As Ed Badger used to say " Stick with me and I'll show you Oysters as big as Diamonds!"