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This is Unconstitutional Right

thcri

thcri

Gone But Not Forgotten
PELOSI: Buy a $15,000 Policy or Go to Jail

How can they force this on anyone and what about the ones that can not afford it and it is up to Nancy to decide if you can afford it or not??

“If the government determines that the taxpayer’s unpaid tax liability results from willful behavior, the following penalties could apply
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I am assuming this is right out of the Health Care Bill?


Prosecution is authorized under the Code for a variety of offenses. Depending on the level of the noncompliance, the following penalties could apply to an individual:
• Section 7203 – misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year.
• Section 7201 – felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years.”
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muleman

muleman

Gone But Not Forgotten
GOLD Site Supporter
Tell them to come on up the mountain and collect it! I will "exercise" my other rights on them.
 
JEV

JEV

Mr. Congeniality
GOLD Site Supporter
Ya know, that's one angry bitch inside that body. How so much contempt can reside in one person is amazing to me. She makes me want to call her the "C" word, because of her hatred and contempt for good, hard working people. She truly has a dark soul.
 
XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq

XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq

Master of Distraction
Staff member
SUPER Site Supporter
They probably know this. They will then let the courts over-turn this part of the bill and we will all be stuck paying for the healthcare for people that don't want to pay. The Democrats will then stand around and act like they "tried" to prevent this from happening but "oh well" what can they do now.

Get ready, stock up on lube, it's going to hurt.
 
ddrane2115

ddrane2115

Charter Member
SUPER Site Supporter
and in 2010 when WE elect a whole new congress and senate they can repeal this silly stupid piece of crap this dumb broad has championed. Her and her boss will need the lube if America wants to start making changes that are needed now more than ever..............like get the bama boy out of the house and on the street where he belongs.

just my thoughts..............
 
mak2

mak2

Active member
I dont like Pelosi and I dont like forcing or being forced to do anything either.

How would you guys, who jsut called Pelosi names etc instead of discussing options, keep people from freeloading the system? Remember that social medicine and "free" healthcare?

What is your plan? How do you propose we do it now?

I see people in the ER all the time that will never, ever pay a dime. How do we stop that?
 
fogtender

fogtender

Now a Published Author
Site Supporter
mak2 said:
I dont like Pelosi and I dont like forcing or being forced to do anything either.

How would you guys, who jsut called Pelosi names etc instead of discussing options, keep people from freeloading the system? Remember that social medicine and "free" healthcare?

What is your plan? How do you propose we do it now?

I see people in the ER all the time that will never, ever pay a dime. How do we stop that?
Click to expand...

Well you see if your Congressional candidate voted for the plan, start a recall of them from office. Don't know how to go about it, but there is a way... any ideas or input?
 
mak2

mak2

Active member
One of the reasons I think the current system is such a failure is because of the inablibty to force freeloaders to pay AND the inability to refuse them treatment. Everyone in this country, if they show up at the ER tongiht, no matter what, gets medical care. End of story and we, as a socitey cannot refues to provide it, not because of attorneys, but because we dont want to watch people in the parking lot of hospitals dying because they cant afford health care. The providers raise the cost of all care provided to people with ability to pay (insurance) and the insurance companies raise our premiums to cover these cost. Of couse they charge enough to ensure profit. We get screwed and the freeloaders get free care. I know you can site anecdotal instances of hospitals and docotros going out of buisness but as a rule the freeloaders jsut raise the cost for all of us. What do we do? I think we only have two choices, push granny out of the ER if she cant pay, or pay, by taxes for everyone.

I get so frustrated with people who just spout the insurance company propoganda (Rush and Beck) because I have seen the industry from the inside for the last 20 years. It is not an honorable system.
 
fogtender

fogtender

Now a Published Author
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mak2 said:
I get so frustrated with people who just spout the insurance company propoganda (Rush and Beck) because I have seen the industry from the inside for the last 20 years. It is not an honorable system.
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You clearly don't watch/listen to them then. They also are down on the insurance companies as well.

Tort reform should be number one, the costs for malpractice insurance from bogus claims is killing doctors that are trying to stay in business.

Getting rid of insurance monopoly by only having one or two per state is another issue they talk about. Insurance companies should be able to practice in all states to promote competition which isn't there.

Kick out some twenty to thirty million illegals and let them back in though the front door with documents and a real tax ID number would also be a good place to start as well. They are killing hospitals along the boarder by getting medical attention and not paying for it.

Beck and Rush are doing more to raise red flags than the people that were elected to protect the Constitution to they swore to protect.
 
BigAl

BigAl

Gone But Not Forgotten
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fogtender said:
You clearly don't watch/listen to them then. They also are down on the insurance companies as well.

Tort reform should be number one, the costs for malpractice insurance from bogus claims is killing doctors that are trying to stay in business.

Getting rid of insurance monopoly by only having one or two per state is another issue they talk about. Insurance companies should be able to practice in all states to promote competition which isn't there.

Kick out some twenty to thirty million illegals and let them back in though the front door with documents and a real tax ID number would also be a good place to start as well. They are killing hospitals along the boarder by getting medical attention and not paying for it.

Beck and Rush are doing more to raise red flags than the people that were elected to protect the Constitution to they swore to protect.
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Very good post :smile:and I can agree with everything but your last sentence.

Rush is so conceited that I honestly do not know how anybody can listen to him and take him seriously .

You do not win me over by making non-funny remarks and Immitating badly the way his opponents talk .Thats a sign of a very immature debaterand a total loser . He is the worst I have ever seen . At least Glen Beck seems to have a little more class , in that department .
Gave me solid and good debating skills with accuracy in the reporting and no bullshit . Then I will make my own decision who I believe is right .

Not some loud mouth who just wants to be heard .

The GOP needs to remove itself as far away from the Rush Limbaughs types of this world as possible .

He causes more problems than he helps and the Republicans do not need any more problems . The last Election proved that .
 
BigAl

BigAl

Gone But Not Forgotten
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mak2 said:
You think Rush could end up being the downfall of the GOP?
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I honestly believe he ain't helpping it any , and I been a "dyed in the wool" Republican voter for 38 years .
 
jpr62902

jpr62902

Jeanclaude Spam Banhammer
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fogtender said:
Tort reform should be number one, the costs for malpractice insurance from bogus claims is killing doctors that are trying to stay in business.
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It's not bogus claims that cost so much. It's the monumental damages that usually result from malpractice. Premiums also get hiked in bad economic times -- if Doctors' Mutual doesn't have sufficient funds to pay claims from their investments, they gotta collect more premiums to make up the difference.

The Congressional Budget Office estimates that the 2009 costs of medical malpractice (premiums, settlements, awards and administrative costs) amount to only 2 percent of total healthcare expenditures.

They also estimate that tort reform would reduce healthcare expenditures by .5 percent. So healthcare costs drop to 199 from 200, courtesy of tort reform.

Is there an overall health impact? The CBO cited a few studies and the findings range from an increase in mortality rates by .2 percent, to no impact.


See here: http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/106xx/doc10641/10-09-Tort_Reform.pdf

Regardless, tort reform does not appear to be the panacea that you suggest it would be.
 
XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq

XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq

Master of Distraction
Staff member
SUPER Site Supporter
jpr62902 said:
It's not bogus claims that cost so much.
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It's the fear of the bogus claims and how the insurance companies use the bogus claims as a tool to justify the rates they charge. There is a ripple effect.

Patients use the threat of lawsuits to bully their doctors both directly and indirectly. Doctors use the "fear" of lawsuits to justify unnecessary tests and shotgun treatments. Both patients and doctors do this deliberately and some do it subconsciously.

So in the end while the over all amount of claims may not be the significant they are causing a much greater impact on the overall system.

Removing the monster payouts would be a good step in the right direction.
 
jpr62902

jpr62902

Jeanclaude Spam Banhammer
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Are you slowin down, PB? I was expecting your response much sooner. :0

With regard to defensive medicine, the CBO discusses this as well. They estimate that tort reform would reduce defensive medicine, and thus overall healthcare expenditures, by .3 percent. Again, tort reform isn't the silver bullet it's widely perceived to be ...

This thread bears repeating:

http://www.forumsforums.com/3_9/showthread.php?t=29102
 
jpr62902

jpr62902

Jeanclaude Spam Banhammer
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PBinWA said:
Removing the monster payouts would be a good step in the right direction.
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The reason there are monster payouts is usually because there are monster damages -- as in medical expenses for life long care. You don't want to relieve doctors from responsibility for causing those types of damages, do you?
 
BigAl

BigAl

Gone But Not Forgotten
SUPER Site Supporter
Just a thought jpr62902 , and I really don't care , but are you really a "Rocket Surgeon" or a lawyer ?
 
pirate_girl

pirate_girl

legendary ⚓
GOLD Site Supporter
It makes my head hurt.
I'd agree that Jimmy does a good job at the rocketry surgeony stuff.
 
Bobcat

Bobcat

Je Suis Charlie Hebdo
GOLD Site Supporter
He meant Sprocket Sturgeon. There, I hope that clears up any confusion anyone may have had. :thumb:
 
fogtender

fogtender

Now a Published Author
Site Supporter
BigAl said:
Very good post :smile:and I can agree with everything but your last sentence.

Rush is so conceited that I honestly do not know how anybody can listen to him and take him seriously .

You do not win me over by making non-funny remarks and Immitating badly the way his opponents talk .Thats a sign of a very immature debaterand a total loser . He is the worst I have ever seen . At least Glen Beck seems to have a little more class , in that department .
Gave me solid and good debating skills with accuracy in the reporting and no bullshit . Then I will make my own decision who I believe is right .

Not some loud mouth who just wants to be heard .

The GOP needs to remove itself as far away from the Rush Limbaughs types of this world as possible .

He causes more problems than he helps and the Republicans do not need any more problems . The last Election proved that .
Click to expand...

Yeah, Rush has a certian amount of "Arrogance" in his show, but if you listen to him often, you will see past that and he makes some very valid points. Most people don't like him have never really listened to his show, and claim they don't like him just because someone else told them that.


I do when I am driving to Fairbanks for the Radiation crap and we don't have very many choices to listen to. There are a lot of times that I fully don't aggree with him, but there are times he is dead on too.

There are times though I will switch over to the Church channel just to listen to something different, my FM band isn't working well...
 
BigAl

BigAl

Gone But Not Forgotten
SUPER Site Supporter
fogtender said:
Yeah, Rush has a certian amount of "Arrogance" in his show, but if you listen to him often, you will see past that and he makes some very valid points. Most people don't like him have never really listened to his show, and claim they don't like him just because someone else told them that.


I do when I am driving to Fairbanks for the Radiation crap and we don't have very many choices to listen to. There are a lot of times that I fully don't aggree with him, but there are times he is dead on too.

There are times though I will switch over to the Church channel just to listen to something different, my FM band isn't working well...
Click to expand...

Well I have listened to him for years , and yes you are correct that at certain times he is dead on . But so is a "Broken Clock" twice a day . I use to listen to him when he was on a little station in Sacramento . That was long before he got synditcated(sp) . He was not as full of himself back then and that was before his drug problem .
 
B

bczoom

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Staff member
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mak2 said:
We get screwed and the freeloaders get free care. I know you can site anecdotal instances of hospitals and docotros going out of buisness but as a rule the freeloaders jsut raise the cost for all of us. What do we do? I think we only have two choices, push granny out of the ER if she cant pay, or pay, by taxes for everyone.

I get so frustrated with people who just spout the insurance company propoganda (Rush and Beck) because I have seen the industry from the inside for the last 20 years. It is not an honorable system.
Click to expand...
I don't have a lot of time to elaborate on these points of your post but can you explain to me how spending $1,000,000,000,000.00 is a better, more honorable system? If there's a group I trust less then the insurance companies, it's the federal government. At least you can sue or fight against the insurance companies.
 
mak2

mak2

Active member
We have a system designed to make a profit for the healthcare system. The insurance companies are just a synergistic cog in the wheel of the system. You cannot refuse to buy their goods and services, so free market controls really never come into play. You cant think of a better way?
 
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