• Please be sure to read the rules and adhere to them. Some banned members have complained that they are not spammers. But they spammed us. Some even tried to redirect our members to other forums. Duh. Be smart. Read the rules and adhere to them and we will all get along just fine. Cheers. :beer: Link to the rules: https://www.forumsforums.com/threads/forum-rules-info.2974/

My Bloody Wife

daedong

New member
I am in the process of building an implement shed 40'x18' open front. Anyway my wife is going on and on about the fact that I have not summited plans to council. I have no intention of doing such a thing as all it will achieve is an increase in council rates. How do I deal with her blind obedience to bureaucracy?
 

thcri

Gone But Not Forgotten
I have no intention of doing such a thing as all it will achieve is an increase in council rates.

Don't want to pay your fair share?


How do I deal with her blind obedience to bureaucracy?

Why don't you try listening to her?

I don't like taxes or council rates in your case but I have no time for people that cheat the system.


jmo

murph
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
As much as I don't like paying taxes or government intrusion in my life, one thing that really irritates me are neighbors who bitch about the potholes in the roads but then license their cars in a neighboring state to avoid the higher in-state rates, or the folks who hide income to illegally avoid paying their fair share. Both cases simply shift more of the burden onto me and others who follow the rules. Don't much like all the rules, but generally find it is better to follow them. My advice would be to make peace with your wife, she is right.
 

Deadly Sushi

The One, The Only, Sushi
SUPER Site Supporter
I wouldnt tell the counsil. Tell your wife if its so important to her then she has to pay by selling some of her belongings. :thumb:
 

DaveNay

Klaatu barada nikto
SUPER Site Supporter
Well Vin, I don't know what capabilities your council has for enforcement authority, but in my county, there are clear cases where the zoning board ordered a landowner to undo all work, and to pay fines. We do have a distinction though between agricultural buildings and residential. A permit for an agricultural building carries a $0 fee, with no code inspections, whereas a residential building has a percentage fee, plus inspections.

I would guess that from your description of your business, you would definitely fall under the agricultural rules.

The tax issue is unavoidable, as they will find out at some time.
 

daedong

New member
Murph and Bob,
Interesting responses:halo:. Had this been an all Australian site the responses I think would have been very different. I guess this difference stems from our convict heritage. We make heroes out of bush rangers.:smile:

I am actually saving the council money. they will not have to pay anyone to review my plans, inspect the site and send out approval. All of which would cost a lot more than the the few dollars they may add on to my rates! Which BTW I used only to pad the post as I doubt the capital value of my property would change and my rates are based on capital value.:yum:

If you blokes had to pay the taxes we pay here you'd have had a civil war about it by now. :yum:

Come on guys lighten up, life's too serious. I bet you guys never try to jump a queue either! (We try not to even have them here):thumb:
 
Last edited:

daedong

New member
Dave,
they will know, we have regular aerial photos taken. I also know they will do nothing about it except maybe ask me to submit plans when they discover it. This is the best way around bureaucracy, saves me time and council money.:yum:
 

pirate_girl

legendary ⚓
GOLD Site Supporter
I am in the process of building an implement shed 40'x18' open front. Anyway my wife is going on and on about the fact that I have not summited plans to council. I have no intention of doing such a thing as all it will achieve is an increase in council rates. How do I deal with her blind obedience to bureaucracy?

Good Luck.
When I lived in the UK my hubby wanted to make major changes in the garden, as well as add on to the shed.
There was no way we avoided the council finding out about it.
I think things over there and where you are may be pretty much the same.
 

thcri

Gone But Not Forgotten
I am actually saving the council money. they will not have to pay anyone to review my plans, inspect the site and send out approval. All of which would cost a lot more than the the few dollars they may add on to my rates!

Your conscience not mine. It is still against your laws.
 

ddrane2115

Charter Member
SUPER Site Supporter
When I put up my small shed many years ago it did not "need" a permit for the shed but the fact that I had electric service from the pole going to it, i had to have one.

when I built my barn, it was needed due to it being 'anchored' to the ground. Again the electric had to be inspected..........at no cost to me. The permit was 15.00, much less than they paid the guy to come to the house and inspect my electric job.........

and he liked it! He was surprised I did it myself.
 

Bobcat

Je Suis Charlie Hebdo
GOLD Site Supporter
I am in the process of building an implement shed 40'x18' open front. Anyway my wife is going on and on about the fact that I have not summited plans to council. I have no intention of doing such a thing as all it will achieve is an increase in council rates. How do I deal with her blind obedience to bureaucracy?


They need to get out of your business and stay the hell off your property. And anyone who believes in property tax (I assume that's what council rates are) on this side of the Pacific is just plain un-American. Property taxes are an evil that allows the government to take the homes of the elderly and others who can't afford the tax or who might wish to live a subsistence livestyle. Property tax is proof that you don't own your home and must rent it from the government.
 

pirate_girl

legendary ⚓
GOLD Site Supporter
Not only did we (UK) have to pay a higher council tax monthly, there was also the vehicle tax duty (that stupid sticker in the window on my shitty Renault 19 lol) and Tv ownership tax!
Sure they have free health care, but they screw the hell out of you in every other area.
 

daedong

New member
They need to get out of your business and stay the hell off your property. And anyone who believes in property tax (I assume that's what council rates are) on this side of the Pacific is just plain un-American. Property taxes are an evil that allows the government to take the homes of the elderly and others who can't afford the tax or who might wish to live a subsistence livestyle. Property tax is proof that you don't own your home and must rent it from the government.

Bob, this is the response I was expecting when posting this thread. Lesson learnt, never preempt what sort of replies you may get from a post:rolf2::rolf2::rolf2:

Now the truth to the issue is the second hand materials I am using would not be accepted by council:bonk::rolf2:

I am more worried about the traditional owners trying to claim my land!
 

American Woman

New member
Site Supporter
They need to get out of your business and stay the hell off your property. And anyone who believes in property tax (I assume that's what council rates are) on this side of the Pacific is just plain un-American. Property taxes are an evil that allows the government to take the homes of the elderly and others who can't afford the tax or who might wish to live a subsistence livestyle. Property tax is proof that you don't own your home and must rent it from the government.
Now this is more like it! I agree :thumb:
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
Well I totally agree that bobpierce makes an excellent point, while I totally detest property taxes as probably one of the worst forms of taxation ever devised, the fact is that laws do exist and taxation, as much as we hate it is there to pay for all the services that people demand. Thing that pisses me off the most is the fact that most of the people who want big government seem to work the hardest to evade the taxes that are needed to pay for the 'free' services they demand from the government.

So to BobP I totally agree. However that is really a side discussion to what Vin is doing. Vin, on the other hand, is the guy who seems to advocate that we in the US should accept big government health care and other socialized (or near-socialized) programs, yet Vin is just like my neighbors who register their cars in Illinois and then complain about Indiana roads. Evade the tax and then bitch about the services.

I'm sorry but it is wrong. In fact if you boil it down, it is stealing. Theft from the government is often treated as a 'sport' by people, but really when you evade your tax all you do is push your share of the tax onto your neighbor.
 

XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq

Master of Distraction
Staff member
SUPER Site Supporter
They need to get out of your business and stay the hell off your property. And anyone who believes in property tax (I assume that's what council rates are) on this side of the Pacific is just plain un-American. Property taxes are an evil that allows the government to take the homes of the elderly and others who can't afford the tax or who might wish to live a subsistence livestyle. Property tax is proof that you don't own your home and must rent it from the government.

What he said!:thumb:
 

urednecku

Active member
Site Supporter
They need to get out of your business and stay the hell off your property. And anyone who believes in property tax (I assume that's what council rates are) on this side of the Pacific is just plain un-American. Property taxes are an evil that allows the government to take the homes of the elderly and others who can't afford the tax or who might wish to live a subsistence livestyle. Property tax is proof that you don't own your home and must rent it from the government.

Well put. I've said that for years.
I understand that 100 years ago there was NO taxes, yet America was still the richest country in the world. During the World War, they had to implement taxes to fund the war. I understand that. But things have totally gotten out of hand.
Last year, I paid my income taxes, like I do every year. (don't remember the %, probably about 15%, but I paid.)
Just look at the phone bill. For my house phone & internet, our "taxes & surcharges" figures to about 19%
Our cell phone figures to a little over 13%
(15% + 19% +13%=47%.........You see where I'm going with this?)
I often wonder just how much of a percentage we actually pay to taxes, by the time you figure income, phone, electric, car, gas, etc., etc............
EVERY thing you do, is taxed. You have to pay those taxes with money that has already been taxed. WTF???
America needs to abandon all these taxes.
Go to a strait tax base, probably 2% would bring lots more money to the government than they get now. If you make $10,000 this year, send $200.00 to Uncle Sam. If you make $100 million, $2 million is taxes. I don't care what you had to buy, what your payroll was, how much you put in an IRA. Two percent of what you take in goes to Uncle Sam, who will distribute it to the state, county, city, town, by population.
Like my dear late Dad said, "I wouldn't mind paying taxes so much if so much of it wasn't pissed away by the politions."
Ever watch a road crew work? 1 person using a shovel, and 6 or 8 more standing around watching.
:soapbox: I'll get off now. Ya got me started.

daedong, good luck, however it turns out. Don't forget, :weneedpic
 

fogtender

Now a Published Author
Site Supporter
Murph and Bob,
Interesting responses:halo:. Had this been an all Australian site the responses I think would have been very different. I guess this difference stems from our convict heritage. We make heroes out of bush rangers.:smile:

I am actually saving the council money. they will not have to pay anyone to review my plans, inspect the site and send out approval. All of which would cost a lot more than the the few dollars they may add on to my rates! Which BTW I used only to pad the post as I doubt the capital value of my property would change and my rates are based on capital value.:yum:

If you blokes had to pay the taxes we pay here you'd have had a civil war about it by now. :yum:

Come on guys lighten up, life's too serious. I bet you guys never try to jump a queue either! (We try not to even have them here):thumb:

Well I have to agree with you on this one (mostly), build it and don't say anything. They will reappraise your place when they get around to it and tax you accordingly when they get to it. If your council is like a local "Home owner's assn." then they may have covens or restrictions on what you can build that you signed and aggreed to when you bought the property and the neighbors will "Rat you out".

Where I live there is no Borough or County, so I have no property taxes (nor do I get any of the city services that I don't pay for), I don't have to apply for any permits to build anything on my property either.

I don't have a city that takes money and gives little in return, other than pot holes in the roads and taxes me on my "Toys", house, vehicles, and breathing air.

If I want to drive on the highway, I buy a license plate for my vehicle.

I pay through the nose in road taxes via the fuel pump (State/Federal taxes included, local taxes at the city pumps).

I have to pay my Federal Income taxes.

I pay for my phone service (taxes included).

I pay for electrical service (taxes included).

I have insurance if the house burns down and don't have a fire department closer than it would take for the house to be embers for them to roast hot dogs when they got here.

I have Satellite TV (hundreds of channels and nothing good on) and High speed Satellite Internet sevice that is better than most city dwellers (Federal taxes on those services)

You don't know how many freedoms you have lost until you get to someplace that you don't have the restrictions.

I can step out my door and hunt, shoot, make noise and in general enjoy myself.

Oh, and the high taxes you mentioned that you pay:bonk: , is I would bet, are due to the health care system that you support and it is eating your GNP that most of us are against for that very reason. Funny how you gave the reason that you don't want to report the building because of the taxes that supports the healthcare system you like....:thumb:
 

daedong

New member
Vin, on the other hand, is the guy who seems to advocate that we in the US should accept big government health care and other socialized (or near-socialized) programs, yet Vin is just like my neighbors who register their cars in Illinois and then complain about Indiana roads. Evade the tax and then bitch about the services.

I'm sorry but it is wrong. In fact if you boil it down, it is stealing. Theft from the government is often treated as a 'sport' by people, but really when you evade your tax all you do is push your share of the tax onto your neighbor.

Bob, can you please quote me where I have bitched about services.

Well once again you have categorized me incorrectly. I believe you have blindly never understood what I have said regarding health Care.

I have never said I won't pay, just making it as hard as I can because I resent being penalized for making development, and by the way there is no correlation with this and health care.

Must go running late for work the nation needs my tax.
 

thcri

Gone But Not Forgotten
I have no intention of doing such a thing as all it will achieve is an increase in council rates.

Bob, can you please quote me where I have bitched about services.


You bitched about the council rates which means to me you are bitching about the rates versus the service your getting out of it.


I don't like taxes myself and I don't care the way my taxes are being spent but it is the system the way it is and I think it is wrong for people to abuse the system. You may think it cost them more to do your assessment but that does not give one the right to steer around what is law.

Your the first one to complain about the health care system in the United States but if everyone would pay their fair share and not abuse it like your doing then maybe, just maybe we would have a better system.


jmo
murph
 

sports850

Member
Do a little research , here in NSW it used to be legal to put up a machinery shed of pretty much any size so long as it didn't have walls (picture a 40 foot by 60 foot carport ...) without needing aproval providing you were in a rural area . You also didn't need council permission to enclose a carport into a garage whereas you'd need permission to build it as a shed . It might be worth your while to build it as an open shed first , then a year or so later add the walls .

I don't know about SA but up here the councils are getting bad and coming out to "inspect and certify" all on-site septic systems and checking to make sure there aren't any unauthorised buildings at the same time . Once they've gone through all the on-site septic systems they're rumoured to be going to check all council sewered connections as well (read between the lines , they're using it as an excuse to get access to the properties and check for unauthorised buildings) . Also two years ago they announced a program of using aerial photography to document trees on properties and will repeat the process every 5 years to catch illegal clearing ....
 

daedong

New member
sports850, thanks for the tips.

I have had all day to think about this post. I posted this thread as a light hearted topic, Whether I submit plans to council or not is not a moral issue to me. Submitting plans if just a head fuc, Its nothing really to do with any small additional cost regarding tax that I might incur, or what materials I am allowed to use, it simply is a matter of I can't be bothered, If however the council decided later to fine me or orders me to demolish it I will cop it on the chin.

The fact that two people have chosen to attack me on the "holier than thou" grounds is interesting. I have all my life earned an honest living from either manufacturing or by producing a product that is not only not detrimental to others well being, but is actually beneficial. We can't all say that can we? I also happen to believe that denying decent medical cover to huge numbers of people (50 million with no medical cover and 50 million with insufficient medical cover) is far more immoral than not submitting a plan to council. Your consciences though, not mine. I sleep ok at night.

Now lets talk about civil liberties!:thumb:
 

Bobcat

Je Suis Charlie Hebdo
GOLD Site Supporter
Good post, I agreed with you...right up to the 'denying decent medical cover' thing. No one here is denying anyone anything. Anyone can go get coverage here just like I did. Yeah, it's expensive, but I believe a free market will eventually take care of that. How the heck did we all survive before the government showed up to take care of us? :pat:

Just remember that anything the government does is by force. Whether insisting that you have your shack inspected or taking my earnings from me to give to someone else, if either of us denies them we will be imprisoned or killed. That's not just hyperbole; it happens all the time. Most people do just roll over, though. How will mandatory health care be 'enforced'? If I refuse to accept or contribute to it, what will the consequences be to me? If you refuse to let the council(?) on your property, what will they do? Go away? We should do everything we can to limit the governments forceful intervention into our lives.

Damn, I just know this will look like my typical 3AM post when I see it again later today. :smileywac
 

daedong

New member
Skurka, Thcri, foggy

Please read, don't twist my views again. Read, and if you still don't understand, read it again. Then if you still don't understand, how about asking me a question, not telling me what you think I believe?

Murph No one here (in this thread) has advocated free for all.
My view is that private health should be encouraged, those that can afford it should pay. but private cover needs to be easily accessible for all. Health and employment should not be mixed. ( I know this is a US cultural thing but as an outsider I see pitfalls) and one should never be denied cover because of preexisting conditions, where will this led, sorry no cover because you have an X gene.

We have problems here with some folks not wanting to join private cover but at least they have to pay a levy. I personally think the levy should be higher than it is for those that earn beyond a certain $.
[FONT=&quot]
Thanks for that Bob.

I would have loved to have seen the program. reading that snippet it is truly amazing how many different health systems are out there. On the surface, of the five talked about, Japan seem to have the best system (personal belief). I personally don't like systems that are paid for from taxes, except for those under privileged. I know it goes against the grain of many but compulsory insurance of some sort for those that can afford it is a must. It is simply unfair for the rest of the community to be expected to pay for those that can afford it that chose not to cover themselves. Denial of this fact is being blind, we the community will pay in some way or another.

I know that many of you will state that Japan does not have an alien problem like the USA, granted, but the alien problem has nothing to do with what sort of health system you have as citizens, because you as good people will look after them anyway.

Did anyone watch the program? I'd love to hear your views.
[/FONT]
 

daedong

New member
Good post, I agreed with you...right up to the 'denying decent medical cover' thing. No one here is denying anyone anything. Anyone can go get coverage here just like I did. Yeah, it's expensive, but I believe a free market will eventually take care of that. How the heck did we all survive before the government showed up to take care of us? :pat:

Just remember that anything the government does is by force. Whether insisting that you have your shack inspected or taking my earnings from me to give to someone else, if either of us denies them we will be imprisoned or killed. That's not just hyperbole; it happens all the time. Most people do just roll over, though. How will mandatory health care be 'enforced'? If I refuse to accept or contribute to it, what will the consequences be to me? If you refuse to let the council(?) on your property, what will they do? Go away? We should do everything we can to limit the governments forceful intervention into our lives.

Damn, I just know this will look like my typical 3AM post when I see it again later today. :smileywac

I respectfully disagree with you. private cover in the USA is often denied to those with preexisting conditions. Those that are on low wages with no cover from employers simply could not pay the loaded cover for individual (non-employer funded) cover.


BTW, you had better make sure your health cover is up to date because if you don't stop posting at 3 am and get some sleep you'll be needing it soon.:smile:
 

Bobcat

Je Suis Charlie Hebdo
GOLD Site Supporter
I respectfully disagree with you. private cover in the USA is often denied to those with preexisting conditions. Those that are on low wages with no cover from employers simply could not pay the loaded cover for individual (non-employer funded) cover.
<snip>

I see it as not much different than auto insurance. If you have a lot of accidents, a very expensive car, or a history of DUI...you're going to pay more or be denied. If you can't afford auto insurance with your wages, you ain't driving. Of course that is a bit simplified and someone who is injured/ill through no fault of their own should not be treated like a DUI perpetrator. But there is a comparison to be made here. Since the drunk/wreckless driver can't afford his premiums or is denied coverage, does the govt need to step in and force coverage for all?

And what about that drunk suffering from liver damage, etc? Why should I be forced to pay for his coverage? Why should an insurance company be forced to take him on as a risk?

When I really try to figure this out, it just seems a vicious circle. Since insurance can cover it, the medical companies raise the cost knowing they can get more profit, so insurance raises premiums to maintain their profit. Keeps climbing that way until everyone complains they can't afford the coverage. In steps the big (dare I say limitless?) pockets of the government. Now the medical companies will know the sky is the limit. :pat:

Before I shuffle off to my lovely Super8 Motel bed :smileywac, let's get back on topic....

So why are you building a sub-standard shed? What are the inferior materials you're using? How much extra would it cost to do it right? Is that significantly more than the tax will be? How much will the tax be? If it's just a nuisance for you to have them come out and inspect, can you get your wife/daughter to show them the edifice whilst you make yourself scarce? Stuff like that... :blink:
 
Last edited:

sports850

Member
I can't really comment on the South Australian version (they're a little backwards down there :poke: ) but in New South Wales it costs about $450 to $500 to lodge an application for a building , the council then looks at the plans for a few minutes and so long as it isn't held up by fairy's passes the plans but then procrastinates for between 6 and 18 weeks , advertises asking for neighbours to comment on the planned construction and sends some junior engineer out to see if they need to get surveyors to make sure it's on the right block . This is all well and good if it's in a residential area where you're neighbours have to put up with it or it may be too close to a boundary but in Rural areas you are likely to still need a surveyor to check the location in relation to the boundaries that are 300 meters away . I'm assuming things are different in America but say you lived in a remoteish area on a large piece of land , you still have to pay and apply to build an open shed , probably pay for someone to come out and look at where you want to put it and still wait 3 or more months before they decide you can build something that no one will live in and very few people will ever see . Approval for something like a basic shed is a painful process here .
 

daedong

New member
sports850, I think I know what state is backward.:rolf2:

Not sure but I would say to submit plans for a shed would be less than a $150 and would be approved at the next council meeting 4 weeks max.

Bob P the materials are secondhand but not substandard there is nothing wrong with them for my purpose. I don't exactly live in the middle of the city.
 

sports850

Member
Not sure but I would say to submit plans for a shed would be less than a $150 and would be approved at the next council meeting 4 weeks max.

OK , standard fee here regardless of what you're building , even for a verandah around an existing house ... Ahh well , I guess we do have to pay for these poorer states that constantly have their hands out to us so they have to charge us more ...:bangin:
 

thcri

Gone But Not Forgotten
Skurka, Thcri, foggy

Please read, don't twist my views again. Read, and if you still don't understand, read it again. Then if you still don't understand, how about asking me a question, not telling me what you think I believe?


I don't know who threw in Health insurance, you were talking about cheating your government and you asked for our opinion and you got it. Next time don't frickin ask if you don't like what you hear :rolleyes:

murph
 
Top