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Old 12-08-2018, 12:09 AM
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Default GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

Maybe this is my rant... but it is automotive in nature....

My daughters 2014 Malibu with just at 100K miles on it, had to have new springs installed in all four corners of the car, to get the alinement correct, as there is no camber adjustment. The springs settled, or you could say collapsed.

This caused the camber to go negative, and wear out the inside of the rear tires. When replaced we discovered that the shift in weight distribution was enough to throw it out on the front end as well..

I have had many vehicles with way more miles than that car has. Not to mention the lack of ability to adjust this, as I don't think I have ever had another car with out this feature. I have to wonder why...

The other daughter has a 2012 Buick Regal, and now I am wondering if the same will happen to it as well..

No good for GM can come of this, it is a normal condition caused by poor spring manufacturing or an inadequate spring for the duty intended..

So you can say I am an unhappy GM customer for sure. No more GM products will I buy, new or used..

Regards, Kirk
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Old 12-08-2018, 09:32 AM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..


Note the graph at the 4:23 mark, and another at 5:14. It shows you what the "Obama bail out" has done for the tax payers.... No wonder Trump has weighed in on this..

I am beginning to think this guy hits it on the head...

Regards, Kirk
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Old 12-08-2018, 09:54 AM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

The last GM car that ever interested me was the 1969 Z28. After that, no desire ever to own one and never have. Yes, that included the Corvette. The last one of those I like is the 63 Split Window Coupe. Always been a Mopar and Ford guy and also loved my Rambler American.

Gas & Oil forever.
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Old 12-08-2018, 10:21 AM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

I came for a once proud family of GM auto's and trucks.

We had not bought anything GM in years. But mistakenly I bought my daughters these two used GM products, as they were reasonably priced and in good condition. The Buick has so far been ok. But this Malibu is a turd for sure.

The cost to the American tax payer for the bail out is quite large according to the graphs in the video. And it isn't over yet either.

It looks to me like the only the only people that are making out with GM is the Peoples Republic of China...

My old Trans Am and our older Corvette were made by the old GM and have over the years been good cars. But anything that is made by the new GM seems to be cheaply made, and not reliable enough for the long haul I expected of them..

I have been buying Chrysler products since 1999, and had not looked back. We have gotten good service from them ever since.. I just wish I would have stuck with Ford or Chrysler when buying used for the daughters....

Regards, Kirk
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Old 12-08-2018, 01:07 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

Funny, I've never had good luck with Dodge/Chrysler stuff. They always seem to have issues.

Wife's 2008 envoy is doing OK at 150K. This weekend I have to try and replace a coolant temp sensor that they stuck in an unreachable location. It's also annoying that they don't have a drain on the radiator so you have to take the bottom hose off just to change the coolant.

In general though, I agree that GM stuff has a cheap feel to it.

Personally, I think all cars have issues - a lot of it has to do with how hard they are driven and how well they are serviced.

Currently, I still like Ford and VW. Not too flashy but they seem well built. Of course, my Ford truck is a 2003 - the new trucks are just too fancy.

The more service I do myself the better the cars seem to run. I hate it when it's something I have to take into a shop for but I don't have all the tools and the time for some of the bigger stuff.

We'll all be driving electric in 10 years - the writing is on the wall.
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Old 12-08-2018, 01:42 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

My current truck is 14 years old, 160K on the clock and no rust and runs like a top but Ford Rangers are noted for their longevity if reasonably taken care and I am meticulous with mine. My next truck will be my last truck I ever buy on this Earth and I can assure you it will NOT be electric. I have a real hard time with seeing electric vehicles as being Dummocrat cars. I would rather not be seen in one.
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Old 12-08-2018, 06:03 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

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Originally Posted by PBinWA View Post
Funny, I've never had good luck with Dodge/Chrysler stuff. They always seem to have issues.

Wife's 2008 envoy is doing OK at 150K. This weekend I have to try and replace a coolant temp sensor that they stuck in an unreachable location. It's also annoying that they don't have a drain on the radiator so you have to take the bottom hose off just to change the coolant.

In general though, I agree that GM stuff has a cheap feel to it.

Personally, I think all cars have issues - a lot of it has to do with how hard they are driven and how well they are serviced.

Currently, I still like Ford and VW. Not too flashy but they seem well built. Of course, my Ford truck is a 2003 - the new trucks are just too fancy.

The more service I do myself the better the cars seem to run. I hate it when it's something I have to take into a shop for but I don't have all the tools and the time for some of the bigger stuff.

We'll all be driving electric in 10 years - the writing is on the wall.
We have had some issues with the Chrysler stuff to, but no mechanical/ chassis issues to date. The old Durango has 190+K on and makes a fine spare for when we need it. Our Current 300C AWD has had computer issues, and I just put 4 new O2 sensors in the exhaust system. Other wise good. I love that now older car. Hard to beat the feel underfoot of a Hemi...

My F 250 is an 06 with now 320K on it. It has the option that people like a rail road or telephone company would have. No carpet, A/C, Cruise, AM/FM, crank windows... In other words not much. Exactly like I think a pickup should be. Wash out the back seat floor with a hose if you have to.. Since I had the 6.0 diesel bulletproofed not an issue..

All American brands seem to have more issue than a Toyota Camry. I wish it were not so...

Regards, Kirk
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Old 12-08-2018, 06:21 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

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Originally Posted by 300 H and H View Post
We have had some issues with the Chrysler stuff to, but no mechanical/ chassis issues to date. The old Durango has 190+K on and makes a fine spare for when we need it. Our Current 300C AWD has had computer issues, and I just put 4 new O2 sensors in the exhaust system. Other wise good. I love that now older car. Hard to beat the feel underfoot of a Hemi...

My F 250 is an 06 with now 320K on it. It has the option that people like a rail road or telephone company would have. No carpet, A/C, Cruise, AM/FM, crank windows... In other words not much. Exactly like I think a pickup should be. Wash out the back seat floor with a hose if you have to.. Since I had the 6.0 diesel bulletproofed not an issue..

All American brands seem to have more issue than a Toyota Camry. I wish it were not so...

Regards, Kirk
A friend of mine runs a small repair garage. He gets my work when I cannot or will not do it myself. The other day he was struggling with removing those God awful pins out of the fixed front brake calipers on the Toyota Tacomas. They rust into place real good. A piss poor setup for anybody in the rust belt and those Tacomas have a history of melting away up here with all the road salt and brine they spread.

Moral of the story, issues with whatever you buy. My Dad used to say they are all wonderful when they run and pieces of shit when they do not.
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Old 12-14-2018, 06:55 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

does that mean your Pontiac is getting replaced with a ford or a dodge
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Old 12-15-2018, 09:08 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

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Originally Posted by 300 H and H View Post
Maybe this is my rant...edit...s 2014 Malibu... there is no camber adjustment. ..


Thats not just a GM issue, Nissan's are the same way too. you have to add shims to align them.
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Old 12-15-2018, 09:35 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

Back in the late 70's when I worked for Enterprise Leasing Co which owns a GM dealership and was GM aligned, I drove mostly GM products. The wife loved 98 Regency Oldsmobile's But the 80's ruined that car line.

Before that I was pure Mopar.

Got into Mercedes in the late 80's. Well built cars, but they cost too much to keep running and depreciate to nothing in a few years. Still, every time I sold one I wondered why. Great cars back then.


I now drive Chrysler products. But all of them are from the Mercedes merger/Alliance.
'95 one ton with a Cumins 303K
'99 Grand Caravan 270K
'2002 Grand Caravan High top 110K
2005 Chrysler Crossfire Karman AMG built 75K
2005 Chrysler Crossfire Karman Roadster 65K

Not a GM part or product in the driveway and never will be one.

Fords are OK good value for the money. But, I'd rather push a Ford than ride in a Chevy.
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Old 12-15-2018, 10:06 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

I have a 2014 Malibu and it's still runs like a dream.
Of course I'm anal about having it serviced to the letter on a regular basis.
It's not quite to the 90,000 mark either.
Surprisingly.
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Old 12-15-2018, 10:50 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

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I have a 2014 Malibu and it's still runs like a dream.
Of course I'm anal about having it serviced to the letter on a regular basis.
It's not quite to the 90,000 mark either.
Surprisingly.
Well I do want to point out that my daughter and her former boyfriend were probably not to kind to hers..... He was a dirt biker that tore up the gravel roads about these parts to the point I had neighbors calling me. He rolled around on top of the hood and roof, pushing them in enough I had to have the local Dentbuster's no paint repair shop remove them.. So that car has been tried and tested the way a then 20 year old could...

She has the 4 cylinder version with a fabric interior. For Christmas she asked for a detailing shop visit for the interior lol... The engine seems to be fine, as well as the transmission. I have always thought GM made very good engines. Good luck with yours. Treat it the way you like to be treated...

Regards, Kirk
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Old 12-16-2018, 08:51 AM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

My family has always been a gm/ford family. We had a nice '79 ford bronco that we bought new and over the years rusted out so dad did a full body job. They always had GM trucks as well. I personally have had all GM with a couple of dodges thrown in the mix until my current ford. Honestly I liked my current truck the most despite it being a money pit. But that's mostly because of the way previous owners treated it.

I have no specific brand loyalty. They all have their problems. Dodge can't make a front end that will stay together. Gm has a good tried and true engine but their front end has had issues over the years. Ford has a good truck but until recent years didn't have a decent engine. The 5.4L engine has been plagued with problems. Exhaust manifolds that keep cracking. A 3 piece spark plug that will disintegrate and risk taking out a cylinder. Faulty cam phasers. Bad coils that crack and need replacement frequently. I could go on. I'm surprised that it took ford this long to come to their senses and put their tried and true 5.0l engine from the mustang into their trucks. I haven't heard anything bad about the 5.0l engine. That's what scares me about the 3.5l v6 engine that I'm getting in the new truck. Those twin turbos are great when they work but looking years ahead what's it going to cost when one fails. But the 3.5l has been around for a while now with no real problem I've heard of.

Canadian eh!!!
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Old 12-16-2018, 10:54 AM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

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Originally Posted by NorthernRedneck View Post
My family has always been a gm/ford family. We had a nice '79 ford bronco that we bought new and over the years rusted out so dad did a full body job. They always had GM trucks as well. I personally have had all GM with a couple of dodges thrown in the mix until my current ford. Honestly I liked my current truck the most despite it being a money pit. But that's mostly because of the way previous owners treated it.

I have no specific brand loyalty. They all have their problems. Dodge can't make a front end that will stay together. Gm has a good tried and true engine but their front end has had issues over the years. Ford has a good truck but until recent years didn't have a decent engine. The 5.4L engine has been plagued with problems. Exhaust manifolds that keep cracking. A 3 piece spark plug that will disintegrate and risk taking out a cylinder. Faulty cam phasers. Bad coils that crack and need replacement frequently. I could go on. I'm surprised that it took ford this long to come to their senses and put their tried and true 5.0l engine from the mustang into their trucks. I haven't heard anything bad about the 5.0l engine. That's what scares me about the 3.5l v6 engine that I'm getting in the new truck. Those twin turbos are great when they work but looking years ahead what's it going to cost when one fails. But the 3.5l has been around for a while now with no real problem I've heard of.

Canadian eh!!!
Canadian EH! let's talkCandian for a moment.


The Only GM product I ever owned of which I still have fond memories was my Oldsmobile Starfire from 1975. Torqey little-6 and often called a poor man's Porsche, it went 200K before the body rusted out. My favorite car. And the doorsills were plated with "Made In Canada!"

Several of our minivans were also birthed in that great nation. Good work ethic and dependable quality. So why does GM want to build cars in Mexico? Or China?
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Old 12-16-2018, 11:28 AM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

GM has made their bed and it's time for them to lay in it..

GM bought back $10 billion in stock since 2015, double what job cuts will save

When General Motors announced it was cutting up to 14,000 jobs and idling five automotive plants, it justified the massive cuts by citing long-term savings. The cuts would free up $6 billion in cash, for a net savings of $4.5 billion in cash by 2020.

The move will "make General Motors more agile, resilient and profitable" while the economy's still revving, CEO Mary Barra told investors Monday. Wall Street seemed to believe her, with GM's stock rising nearly 5 percent and one analyst on the call congratulating her "on getting in front of the curve here."

But GM hasn't exactly been tightfisted in recent years. The company has spent $10.6 billion since 2015 buying back its own shares, according to filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission. Stock buybacks do nothing for a company's productive capacity. But because buybacks reduce the number of shares on the market and thus make a stock more valuable, they can be popular with many investors as well as senior executives who are paid largely in stock.

GM is far from the only company to spend money goosing its stock price. This year alone, corporations have announced some $955.6 billion in buybacks, according to TrimTabs Investment Research, and the figure for the whole year could exceed $1 trillion.

But GM started its stock repurchasing program back in 2015, less than six years after a bankruptcy process that cost U.S. taxpayers $11 billion. (The United Auto Workers and a number of politicians have pointed to the bailout in a vow to fight GM's planned cuts, though it's unclear politicians can do anything to change them.)

The company announced $5 billion of buybacks in March 2015, then added another $4 billion later that year. In 2017, it re-upped and announced a further $5 billion in buybacks, $1.6 billion of which have so far taken place.

GM's stock price dipped 2 percent over that time period.

"[T]hat money could have been used in different ways, including investment in older plants. But would that be a good way to use the earnings? Mary Barra thought not," said Mary Lovely, a senior fellow at the Peterson Institute for International Economics. "She decided that the money should be taken out of the company and returned to shareholders. It's really quite a statement about where she thinks the traditional auto sector in the U.S. is headed."

Where it's headed seems to be an SUV-only road, as GM will stop producing most sedans after next year, leaving only the Chevrolet Malibu and Sonic. (A GM spokesperson also noted that the company plans to launch two new Cadillac luxury cars.) The company's difficulty creating a profitable small car that can compete with imports represents another missed opportunity, according to William Lazonick, professor of economics at the University of Massachusetts Lowell.

"If it was simply that 'There's global competition and we can't make cars in the U.S.,' okay." Lazonick said. "But given the extent to which money's been pouring out on things that are useless, including supporting the stock price, I don't think you can make that argument."

He cited the 2015 buybacks as "particularly egregious" because they happened when the economy was weaker and GM was returning to steady profitability. "They could have put that into the people who build their cars," he said.

A company spokesperson did not address the buyback question, but said in a statement to CBS MoneyWatch that GM was "building on the comprehensive strategy laid out in 2015" and that it would "appropriately reinvest in the business, maintain our strong investment grade balance sheet, and return all available free cash flow to our shareholders."

Where else could GM have gotten $4.5 billion? It could have dipped into $6.5 billion in overseas profits, suggested the Institute for Taxation and Economic Policy, a left-leaning research group.

Although the GOP tax law last year made such repatriation easier, Fortune 500 corporations have overwhelmingly opted since its passage to buy back their stock instead of repatriating their cash, according to public data. "This trend flies in the face of the Trump administration's promise that the corporate tax provisions — especially a tax holiday for profits stashed offshore, of which GM appears to have had as much as $6.5 billion — would spur a flood of new domestic investment," ITEP said.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/gm-boug...uts-will-save/

Now that interest rates are rising I'm sure it's putting a huge crush on them to service this unnecessary debt that was taken on to embellish the upper managements pockets. And just as it always comes back around to the employees and the taxpayers will suffer the consequences of their actions.
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Old 12-16-2018, 12:05 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

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Canadian EH! let's talkCandian for a moment.


The Only GM product I ever owned of which I still have fond memories was my Oldsmobile Starfire from 1975. Torqey little-6 and often called a poor man's Porsche, it went 200K before the body rusted out. My favorite car. And the doorsills were plated with "Made In Canada!"

Several of our minivans were also birthed in that great nation. Good work ethic and dependable quality. So why does GM want to build cars in Mexico? Or China?
Why are they going to Mexico and China? Easy. Cost. Why pay an employee $25 an hour up here when they can get 10 employees in Mexico for the same cost.

Canadian eh!!!
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Old 12-16-2018, 01:01 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

Why build quality products with which to engender Brand loyalty when you can build cheap and spend the money on NFL ads so buyers will settle for cheap throwaways?


After all,,,;
When that business model inevitably fails, you can once again go to the Gubmit for a handout, right?
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Old 12-16-2018, 06:48 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

Quote:
Originally Posted by FrancSevin View Post
Why build quality products with which to engender Brand loyalty when you can build cheap and spend the money on NFL ads so buyers will settle for cheap throwaways?


After all,,,;
When that business model inevitably fails, you can once again go to the Gubmit for a handout, right?
Sometimes, just sometimes mind you, I wish you weren't so prescient.
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Old 12-16-2018, 10:55 PM
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Default Re: GM cars, no matter they are getting out of the car business..

What was it someone said back in '08? Oh yeah, too big to fail!!! maybe if/when the next big one comes this won't come to mind again.
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