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New Steel Tarrifs? What do you Think?

road squawker

Active member
GOLD Site Supporter
I'm O.K. with paying a little more for certain products if it re-develops manufacturing in THIS country.
 

tiredretired

The Old Salt
SUPER Site Supporter
If anybody here questions Trump's motives they should read this article. Hardly a definitive study but a quick overview on what the Chicom's intent has been since 1991. If the steel needs to be made, lets make it here. Much less pollution then if it is made over there.

http://www.breitbart.com/radio/2018...ll-have-carpet-bombed-the-american-heartland/

Seems I can easily offend goofy liberals with my choice of words about Trump like savior but show me just one politician ever that actually is trying to fix this problem and doing more then just paying lip service to it. I cannot think of a single one. Not one.

Can you?
 

waybomb

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
Bring the mills back.
We need to become self sufficient. We have the oil, we have the coal, we have the NG, we have big f-in mining machines, we have the farming, we have the stuff carnivores need, let's get to it, make some metal.
Last thing I am concerned with is anything connected to "Global Warming".
 

XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq

Master of Distraction
Staff member
SUPER Site Supporter
There have been on and off tarrifs against Canadian softwood lumber for ages.

This is overdue. China has had a free ride for too long.
 

mla2ofus

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
If it weren't for making our own steel we'd all be speaking German and Japanese today.
Mike
 

jimbo

Bronze Member
GOLD Site Supporter
Bring the mills back.
We need to become self sufficient. We have the oil, we have the coal, we have the NG, we have big f-in mining machines, we have the farming, we have the stuff carnivores need, let's get to it, make some metal.
Last thing I am concerned with is anything connected to "Global Warming".

The problem is this. Unless we drastically change our current laws, to bring a new plant of this magnitude on line or update an older one is at least a 20 year project. Multiple agencies to approve. Environmental whackos and NIMBY's opposing every step of the way. Millions of dollars spent with no guarantee of success.

We can and have in the past. At the start of WW II the US had no bombers nor any plans for one. From cleared ground, Henry Ford designed the Superfortress, built the mile long plant, and in less than a year the first plane lifted off from the newly built runway. The second one 6 minutes later.

Whether we still have that ability is anybodies guess.
 

300 H and H

Bronze Member
GOLD Site Supporter
The problem is this. Unless we drastically change our current laws, to bring a new plant of this magnitude on line or update an older one is at least a 20 year project. Multiple agencies to approve. Environmental whackos and NIMBY's opposing every step of the way. Millions of dollars spent with no guarantee of success.

We can and have in the past. At the start of WW II the US had no bombers nor any plans for one. From cleared ground, Henry Ford designed the Superfortress, built the mile long plant, and in less than a year the first plane lifted off from the newly built runway. The second one 6 minutes later.

Whether we still have that ability is anybodies guess.

Maybe Trump is doing this to bulldoze those agency and laws that are in the way to our progress?

I have a feeling he has thought this trough, and has a plan, just not telling anyone about it. Or so I hope...

Regards, Kirk
 

FrancSevin

Proudly Deplorable
GOLD Site Supporter
The problem is this. Unless we drastically change our current laws, to bring a new plant of this magnitude on line or update an older one is at least a 20 year project. Multiple agencies to approve. Environmental whackos and NIMBY's opposing every step of the way. Millions of dollars spent with no guarantee of success.

We can and have in the past. At the start of WW II the US had no bombers nor any plans for one. From cleared ground, Henry Ford designed the Superfortress, built the mile long plant, and in less than a year the first plane lifted off from the newly built runway. The second one 6 minutes later.

Whether we still have that ability is anybodies guess.
We don't have Henry Ford but we do have replacements. Droves of them waiting for the opportunity. That will require a government that wants to allow such.

Every citizen can help with very little effort and at no costs to the taxpayers.. Our chance will come this November. Democrat or GOP, if they stand in the way, send 'em packing.

Ya know, in about three months from the 2016 elections, we went from a nation who couldn't find jobs for it's people, with shuttered factories and a cloudy future to one with bright opportunities, not enough available labor and factories running at capacity. Investors are bring cash to the table, corporations bring capital back home and lot's of pay raises for those willing to work for a living. This problem with tariffs and capacities,,,,,, we can handle.
 
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jimbo

Bronze Member
GOLD Site Supporter
Maybe Trump is doing this to bulldoze those agency and laws that are in the way to our progress?

I have a feeling he has thought this trough, and has a plan, just not telling anyone about it. Or so I hope...

Regards, Kirk

Kirk, I'm a Trump voter and and so far a President Trump supporter. One thing I will never give him credit for is thinking things through before opening his mouth.
 

jimbo

Bronze Member
GOLD Site Supporter
We don't have Henry Ford but we do have replacements. Droves of them waiting for the opportunity. That will require a government that wants to allow such.

Every citizen can help with very little effort and at no costs to the taxpayers.. Our chance will come this November. Democrat or GOP, if they stand in the way, send 'em packing.

Ya know, in about three months from the 2016 elections, we went from a nation who couldn't find jobs for it's people, with shuttered factories and a cloudy future to one with bright opportunities, not enough available labor and factories running at capacity. Investors are bring cash to the table, corporations bring capital back home and lot's of pay raises for those willing to work for a living. This problem with tariffs and capacities,,,,,, we can handle.

Back to Henry and the badly needed airplane, what the government did is what was necessary then backed off and took the naysayers with it. Private enterprise prevailed. Henry made a profit, the government got its airplane, and we won the war.
 

tiredretired

The Old Salt
SUPER Site Supporter
We won World War 2 because we already had the manufacturing infrastructure in place. All we needed was to gear up for war production.

Companies like Union Switch & Signal and Singer Sewing Machines converted over to the manufacture of Model 1911 Pistols.

Companies like Underwood Typewriter, IBM, Inland Manufacturing converted over to the manufacture of M1 carbines.

Companies like International Harvester converted over to M1 Garands. The list goes on and on. We won the war because we were able in no small part to outproduce the rest of the world combined.

Trump gets it. Trump understands that a healthy manufacturing base and metals production is critical to the well being of the USA. Without it we are doomed. Support the President. He gets it. If we have to pay a little more for a car or a lawn mower then we pay a little more. We need to quit bitching about it and accept the fact that in many ways our way of life may very well depend on tough decisions like this.
 

tiredretired

The Old Salt
SUPER Site Supporter
Yep. President Trump gets it. About time someone did eh?:thumbup:

Damn tootin' it's about time. That is why I do not get too excited when he says his stoopid shit. All the other stuff he is doing is off the charts and helping America get back to where we should be. I am totally convinced he has America's best interest in mind.

We've had our share of goofy POTUS who are so prim and proper and diplomatic and would not say shit if they had a mouthful. Where did that get us, huh? 24 years of those three damn fools Willy, Bush and Obama, that's where.
 

waybomb

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
And besides, on the environmental thing-most mild note use electric arc.
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
I generally oppose tariffs unless there is proof that there is "below production cost" dumping from a foreign nation with the intent on hurting/wiping out our industrial sectors.

If some nation's industry competes with ours and beats our industry, so be it.

Tariffs just raise our prices.
 

tiredretired

The Old Salt
SUPER Site Supporter
I generally oppose tariffs unless there is proof that there is "below production cost" dumping from a foreign nation with the intent on hurting/wiping out our industrial sectors.

If some nation's industry competes with ours and beats our industry, so be it.

Tariffs just raise our prices.

Ordinarily i would agree, wholeheartedly. I am also a free enterprise capitalist.

However, I think it goes a little deeper then this, right now. Trump fully understands the war China has waged on US manufacturing. Maybe I am wrong, maybe I need to remove my tin foil hat, but the way I see it, it is paramount for China to effectively destroy as much US manufacturing as possible. They have laid waste to our heartland. They are patient, the Chinese always have been, that is why over the course of history they have always simply assimilated their invaders over a period of time. Patience, every long journey begins with the first step type of thing.

Trump understands this, better than anyone. He sees this as a national security issue first and foremost. Something needs to be done and quick or this country will be at a perilous situation if a future conflict were to occur. How can we wage war when the bulk of our steel and aluminum comes from overseas? We all saw what happened in WW2 when the Japanese could not import enough oil and rubber to keep the gears of the war machine turning. We will be in the same boat. We are not talking cell phones or flat screen TV's here. We are talking about steel and aluminum production. The holy grail of manufacturing. Can't build many tanks, planes and ships without it.

He may talk stupid sometimes, but there is no doubt he is the smartest POTUS when it comes to business and national security that we have had in some time. America first. MAGA.

My take anyway.
 

FrancSevin

Proudly Deplorable
GOLD Site Supporter
Paul Ryan fears it's going to start a trade war and hurt the middle class.
Paul Ryan, Lindsay Graham are all from that group of RINO's that worked with Gingrich to create NAFTA. In the following 20 years AMERICA saw it's manufacturing jobs and factories leave in a virtual stampede.

And yet,,,;
When we export a car to Europe, Japan or India, we are charged a 10% tariff. China a 25% tariff. When their same auto products enter the USA,,,; a 2% tariff.

WHAT ABOUT THAT ARRAGEMENT IS FAIR?

From 1865 to the 1900's our nation had high protective tariffs. high enough that over 50% of the federal revenues were from tariffs. That's also when we had the greatest industrial expansion and rise of the middle class. the Fords, the Edison, Hershey, Sears, ,,, yeah, that bunch.

For a moment, let's go back to the beginning. We are a nation in which we the people govern ourselves. THE Donald ran on the promise of re-negotiation of trade deals. We voted him into office. He is re-negotiating trade deals.
Ryan doesn't like it,? To bad. New elections are this fall. Best he checkout his home base. He's been too long in the swamp.
 

tiredretired

The Old Salt
SUPER Site Supporter
Pretty simple really to see who the globalists are, they're the ones who oppose this. What gets me though is they choose to completely ignore the national security implications of buying most of our steel and aluminum overseas.

You would think if some dip stick calls him/herself a Repub on the national level, they would at the very least have a basic understanding of national security and what it takes to maintain it instead of just worrying about getting the lowest price at WallyWorld. Contrary to what the RHINOS and the media say about this, this is NOT a tit for tat issue.
 

tiredretired

The Old Salt
SUPER Site Supporter
Case in point. This guy gets it. Only the dip stick liberals would think even in a limited war with China, they would still sell us all the steel we need at bargain basement prices. :th_lmao::yum:

Screen Shot 2018-03-06 at 3.57.28 PM.png
 

waybomb

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
OK, so, exactly what is the value of the raw metal used in a standard size sedan.
How many pounds of steel and aluminum and their alloys?
Not formed metal, the raw sheet metal.
 

FrancSevin

Proudly Deplorable
GOLD Site Supporter
OK, so, exactly what is the value of the raw metal used in a standard size sedan.
How many pounds of steel and aluminum and their alloys?
Not formed metal, the raw sheet metal.


Steel price per ton



As a good rule of thumb the cost of metal fabrication is about three times the cost of the steel itself. One ton of steel costs about $400. To have this fabricated and one coat of primer applied it would cost approximately $1,200-$1,500 per ton of structural steel.

There is less than 1000 lbs of steel in the modern average car. Estimate I have heard on the actual effect on the cost of a vehicle sticker, less than 2%

Cost on a can of beer less than one percent.

It's really not about the cost of material. It's about the wealth created in making it here in the USA. And the velocity of money when it is created here instead of sent overseas.
 

Catavenger

New member
SUPER Site Supporter
How high a tarriff is this going to be?
Is this something well thought out or just a knee jerk feel good reaction.
Politicians seem to be good at those.
Now I will post a couple of things that are bound to P.O.
People here. What is with this "Rhino" business? Are all Republicans that you disagree with "Rhinos?"
They have to work with Democrats. And I do not think that all Democrats are devils with horns. They are fellow Americans. I can remember a time when the Democratic party was considered the party of the working man.
As for Brietbart, although I agree with much of what they say they definitely have a Right Wing slant. So much of their stuff verges more on opinion rather than fact.
Okay I've posted my opinion so let me have it.
 

FrancSevin

Proudly Deplorable
GOLD Site Supporter
Granite city Steel announced plans to reopen their facility her in East St Louis Metro this morning. Some 1,200 jobs, for the region, in total. This the result of tariff protection and overall economy growth demand for mild structural steel.
 

waybomb

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
400 bucks of steel in a car. Tariff of 80 bucks. So the 20,000 dollar car goes up 80 bucks.

The liberals are making it sound as if 20,000 car will cost 24,000.
 
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