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Corona Virus spreading ... US official says no need to worry
- Thread starter Melensdad
- Start date
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases...th/herd-immunity-and-coronavirus/art-20486808
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-europe-53315983
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/from-ou...ty-against-covid-19-a-dangerous-misconception
https://www.google.com/amp/s/thecon...munity-wont-solve-our-covid-19-problem-139724
There are dozens more....
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-europe-53315983
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/from-ou...ty-against-covid-19-a-dangerous-misconception
https://www.google.com/amp/s/thecon...munity-wont-solve-our-covid-19-problem-139724
There are dozens more....
If that is true its another reason to get it over with, Hanks had it at least 3 months ago. If everyone without conditions get it and get over it. It will be much better for those at risk as long as they stay safe while that happens. If everyone gets it and gets over it before the immunity wears off it will die out on its own. If not and a vaccine lags, it will start over every year.
This is one of the big questions.
Get a measles or a polio or a smallpox shot and you are immune for a LIFETIME
Get flu shot and you are immune for about 6 months to that specific strain of the flu but not to other strains.
So nobody really knows how long immunity will last if you get Covid. If you get it and you are not immune after 6 months that means you can get it over-and-over again. BUT that does not take into account T-cells and other bodily immunoresponses. So we may have immunity for longer, we really just don't know.
New evidence comes out almost every day.
Actually NO it won't die out. It will come back again and again because it is in different stages in different parts of the world and even within different parts of the nation. So no way it will die out. Hell we still have the bubonic plague and lepercy in parts of the world.
Without a vaccine herd immunity is the only way even if it goes through 2021, its the only way to stop it. Until its gone it can spike up anywhere. And yes the cases are spiking up I'm not seeing the mortality rate spike up. That may change but right not it is not. Plow through it or deal with it forever.
True but even in Sweden and in NYC, both areas very hard hit, they don't believe that they are even close to attain herd immunity. So it is very unlikely to happen. Not sure we will ever see a vaccine either. That NYC immunity is only partial and waning.
My zip code has a stunning 0.39% infection rate. Not a chance we will attain herd immunity. Ever. There are some Zip Codes south of me that are even lower. But up in the city areas you can find 2% or even 5%
So where does all of this leave us? I think we agree that a vaccine that is 100% effective likely will never come due to mutations. Herd immunity may be a iffy proposition anytime soon and as you pointed out there is still the plague floating around out there. I don't think everyone staying home is going to work out in the long run either. Maybe therapeutic treatment to minimize death is the only avenue. If its here to stay, I don't care how careful you are odds say at some point you're getting it.
Drs Fauchi and Birx were doing a good job explaining all of this before trump turned the daily briefings into word salads
Again- not a Cuomo fan, but listen to what an informative corona virus briefing sounds like sometime. He’ll probably say a few things about trumps approach that might offend devotees but that is kind of the point. Opinions don’t matter with the virus, facts matter, science matters, data matters. Fauchi hasn’t briefed Trump in over two weeks, not by choice
Where it leaves us is reducing the prevalence in the community, having contact tracers to get outbreaks under control, adjust our behavior so businesses can reopen. Our hospitals nearly went broke when elective procedures were paused. They’ve canceled them in Texas, probably other states too but I haven’t read that yet. Wasn’t this all under control, we’d just quickly tamp out the burning embers? I’m thinking that approach isn’t working
Again- not a Cuomo fan, but listen to what an informative corona virus briefing sounds like sometime. He’ll probably say a few things about trumps approach that might offend devotees but that is kind of the point. Opinions don’t matter with the virus, facts matter, science matters, data matters. Fauchi hasn’t briefed Trump in over two weeks, not by choice
Where it leaves us is reducing the prevalence in the community, having contact tracers to get outbreaks under control, adjust our behavior so businesses can reopen. Our hospitals nearly went broke when elective procedures were paused. They’ve canceled them in Texas, probably other states too but I haven’t read that yet. Wasn’t this all under control, we’d just quickly tamp out the burning embers? I’m thinking that approach isn’t working
My mistake, months not weeks
https://theweek.com/speedreads/924772/fauci-says-hasnt-briefed-trump-covid19-2-months
https://theweek.com/speedreads/924772/fauci-says-hasnt-briefed-trump-covid19-2-months
Fauci and Birx have contradicted themselves every way that it can be done. I have 0 faith in their models. The states control their opening or not. I don't have the answer I'm not that smart and the Cristal ball broke but leaving everything shutdown staying home and doing nothing then expecting things will get better is not a plan, its the definition of insanity. The whole thing has turned political. Idiots can march wherever they want, assemble by the thousands all over the US masked and not masked holding hands and thats OK. Trump has a rally in one location with testing and thats just irresponsible and can't be tolerated.
Fauci and Birx have contradicted themselves every way that it can be done. I have 0 faith in their models. The states control their opening or not. I don't have the answer I'm not that smart and the Cristal ball broke but leaving everything shutdown staying home and doing nothing then expecting things will get better is not a plan, its the definition of insanity. The whole thing has turned political. Idiots can march wherever they want, assemble by the thousands all over the US masked and not masked holding hands and thats OK. Trump has a rally in one location with testing and thats just irresponsible and can't be tolerated.
Contradicted themselves or adapted to new evidence? I think they actually have been adaptive.
As for the models, generally I think a lot of them suck pretty badly and are pretty unreliable. But so far a lot of my projections on death counts and statements I've made about hospitals being overwhelmed have been damn close to accurate. And on top of that the ZeroHedge information has been pretty much spot on.
Totally agree that the media made everything political. I can tell you that the big protests (not the riots) but the big organized protests in Chicago had MASK WEARING protestors. And most of them also kept social distance too. I know reliable people who observed some of them first hand (not as participants) and they indicated there was space between them and they wore masks.
I know that the peaceful protests in my county had people wearing masks and keeping distance.
I know that the violent riots, which were different, had very few masks, saggy pants, and no social distance.
But what the MEDIA says and what is reality are typically 2 different things. I pretty much pay attention to a bunch of news sources and sort through the crap.
I heard trump say this again today. Is that supposed to mean we don’t have a coronavirus problem here in the US?? It’s a pretty silly argument for success
Oh and Cuomo ain’t my hero, just the gubna of the state I live in. Not sure why you keep thinking he and I are of the same fabric. We both think Trump is f’n up the handling of this, that’s about as far as the commonalities go
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I thought Cuomo was your hero due to your earlier posts praising his corona response. It was not praise worthy. How is Trump screwing up the response? its the federal governments job to support the states. Its the Governors job to set the policy as they remind him of every time he makes a suggestion for their state. ( if the President could control state policy, there would not be sanctuary cities and states ) Mr Trump sent Cuomo 40,000 ventilators and a hospital ship that never got used. instead Cuomo sent the patients to the old folks home. Same here in Ca. The whole shutdown was about NOT overwhelming the healthcare system. That never happened at any time. Trump has had to fight the DIMS every step of the way. At first the DIMS didn't want to shut down and fought that along with closing the border with China and Europe. Then there is not enough equipment. They got the equipment. Now they don't want to open business, but its OK for 1000's to protest in lock step. If you can not acknowledge that you're a leftie pretending to be an independent. I acknowledge that no one is perfect but Trump is for this country and the left is not.
True, under our form of government the Governors have more power in their respective states than the President. I recall Cuomo & DeBlasio resisting calls to action from Trump. I recall Cuomo sending sick Covid patients into nursing homes and killing 12,000 formerly elderly people. I recall the NYC health department welcoming tourists to the Chinese New Year parade. I recall DeBlasio resisting closing the schools until AFTER there were hundreds of children infected.
NYC and NJ and Chicago and now Houston did have their ICU units overwhelmed. Perhaps you don't recall, but there were refrigerated trailers parked outside hospitals holding bodies of those who died?
NOTE TO ALL ==> I actually placed this thread into the HEALTH & FITNESS forum to try to avoid some political bitching. Perhaps we can discuss the disease, not the politics? There is a political forum for heated debates, it has looser rules. Not that we have crossed any lines. But I think we are pushing our luck.
( Fauci and Birx have been adaptive) They have to because they have been wrong about most everything. When you are a healthcare expert or a scientist you should not run out and say what you are not 100% sure of. That is incompetent and leads others to make bad decisions. Don't wear masks now masks are mandatory as an example. So for the first month or so no one wore a mask because it was bad for you. If they don't know then they should say I don't know.
Last one from me.
If your assumption about approval is true, 67% of those polled must be lefties. When the dividing line gets shoved up tight to the right I suppose everything else is left. My praise was limited to his briefings being informative.
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/bro...navirus-race-relations-poll/story?id=71704889
I have to go do some work right now, if we are not done lets take BOB's suggestion and go to the political debate forum with it. And yes it was reported yesterday that the poles have a higher sampling of Dems that repubs. see you in the political debate forum.
In my opinion, masks "may" work but like all systems that involve people you have to take into consideration the lowest common denominator. Which from my observation when out an about is that your average mask wearer really isn't doing much to prevent the spread of disease.
The masks are ill fitting, loose, and re-used too many times. The people are generally not following other hygienic protocols and are ultimately compromising any benefits a mask might provide.
At the end of the day the "concept" of wearing a mask is useful but the reality is that it will never make that much difference when applied to the general human population.
The movie Idiocracy was not a comedy - it was a prophetic masterpiece.
The masks are ill fitting, loose, and re-used too many times. The people are generally not following other hygienic protocols and are ultimately compromising any benefits a mask might provide.
At the end of the day the "concept" of wearing a mask is useful but the reality is that it will never make that much difference when applied to the general human population.
The movie Idiocracy was not a comedy - it was a prophetic masterpiece.
I agree with you. I have a beard so the effectiveness of the mask is reduced right there. I wear one every time I'm out in public but realize that it is not giving the protection, if it gives any, that it should. When I'm out in public there are still a large number of people who don't wear them at all despite the Governor's mandate. It's usually younger people who refuse to wear them and their attitude annoys the heck out of my wife. Add to that the number of people who wear them incorrectly. A lot of the places that I have to go in to the people working there are wearing masks but the are pulled down and resting on their chins or they are pulled up and resting below their nose. Again this seems to be mainly younger people. The attitude seems to be that at their age, if they catch it, it won't be too bad and they'll get over it quickly. "You older people, who gives a rat's ass?". My wife calls it the height of selfishness ... and she's right.
Right now my county isn't overwhelmed but the cases are still ticking up. I think that people are suffering from Corona fatigue and think that if they just ignore it, it will just go away. All the service organizations in our little town have opened back up at a time when the infection rate is higher that it was when they were shut down. Makes no sense to me and I'll be staying away from Rotary. All the so-called safety precautions that they are putting in place look good on paper but are unworkable in a closed environment where people meet for lunch and fellowship.
If you want to know when all this will end, don't ask me. I don't have a clue. We're still following the routine that we established when this whole thing began and I don't see an end to it.
PG, I think what you are trying to tell me is that there is no need to panic. Believe me, we're not panicked or paranoid in the slightest. It's really an exercise in risk assessment. Where and under what circumstances are you most likely to contact the virus? The local Methodist Church restarted their Bible study groups and meetings. Two people, one male and one female, were asymptomatic and infected a whole bunch of people. Was attending the meetings worthwhile? Not now it wasn't, especially if you are one of the ones who got infected.
To gain herd immunity, if such a thing actually exists, you have to catch the virus. Now, that may be fine for young people who seem to catch it and recover more quickly but it's a completely different thing for us older, health compromised individuals. People have to assess their own risk and make their own decisions only they need to be sure that the decisions that they make don't put others at risk. It only takes one.
100% agree, I think you have a good understanding of the whole thing, your risk is not the average death rate of .2, you have underlying conditions which raise your odds of being hospitalized, when that happens your odds go up considerably . then if put on a ventilator its about 80% possibility of a bad outcome, near as I can figure.
Going outwards, if a fart can go through your underwear, your pants and fill a room, I'm pretty sure the masks we're using are pretty much useless against something like covid going inwards.
Lol, spike in google searches on size of a fart particle
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.da...jeans-stop-fart-mask-prevent-coronavirus.html
I've been house shopping. Went to look at one that had some kind of problem and all the carpets are gone. I did not smell the overpowering 'air freshener' until I took my N95 mask off. You can figure it out from there.
By the way, some N95 are made for using chemicals like paint and other 'organic vapors'.
By the way, some N95 are made for using chemicals like paint and other 'organic vapors'.
Yup, I have some of those too. They're a hold over from when I was painting the front gate and I've also used them around the house when painting and the fumes are getting bad. I think they have a layer of activated charcoal to absorb the fumes. At least that is what it looks like.
My wife uses the N95 when she goes to the grocery store but absolutely hates them. They make her feel as if she is suffocating. I also have some with the pressure relief valve which makes breathing a little easier but that protects her but not necessarily other people around her. I wish that I could get some more N95s but they're like hen's teeth.
Untrue.
Sorry but covid, at least as far as we understand the transmission, needs a carrier to survive. That carrier is basically your saliva, your sneeze droplets, etc. Without those covid germs don't seem to actually travel.
It’s about time Chuck Woolery spoke up. Maybe he can take over at the CDC now that we are going with the Corona virus isn’t a thing narrative.
Here’s a cnn story everyone will probably agree isn’t fake news. Andy is pretty stupid sometimes, this is right up top of the list. Didn’t he see how over confidence is biting DeSantis in the ass as we speak? What a d-bag.
https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics...-cuomo-covid-19-poster-gupta-lead-sot-vpx.cnn
https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics...-cuomo-covid-19-poster-gupta-lead-sot-vpx.cnn