Grapple: think this would work?

Melensdad · Dec 17, 2005

The lovely Mrs_B and I will be celebrating our 21st anniversary in the spring of 2006 and since I broke down and bought her a diamond for our 20th, I figure I need to get her something more practical for our 21st. I'm considering a grapple.

The primary use will be hauling tree prunings and other lightweight (but very thorny) limbs. I do not expect heavy duty use since I'm getting too old, too lazy and am too much of a weenie to do to hard labor. But with 1000+ thorn trees on the property and many of them need to be pruned back yearly, when I'm done hauling the branches to the burn pile I ususally look like I just had a fight with 9 angry cats and I was the scratching post.

Now here is my problem. New Holland bucket = 54" wide. Kubota bucket = 60" wide. I'd like a grapple that would work with either machine, which by my logic means I need to have both machines plumbed with electric diverter valves and quick connect fittings. But it also means that the grapple mount must be attached to the top of the bucket rather than the sides since the buckets are different widths.

Does anyone have experience with American Products grapple designed for the Kubota BX tractors? It looks like it would easily do what I need done and I'm thinking I could adapt the mount to a top mount instead of a side mount?

Also, with a top mount, how would I stabilize the grapple so it is held tight and doesn't twist/torque the top lip of the bucket when it clamps down?

Dargo · Dec 17, 2005

Sounds like a keen idea to me. Now, I'm glad to see that you are thinking practical for anniversary presents. I'm anxiously waiting to see the results for greedy reasons.

Wow. 21 years this spring! Congratulations! I'll be 21 this next year. I couldn't imagine being married that long.

BoneheadNW · Dec 17, 2005

B_Skurka said:
The lovely Mrs_B and I will be celebrating our 21st anniversary in the spring of 2006 and since I broke down and bought her a diamond for our 20th, I figure I need to get her something more practical for our 21st. I'm considering a grapple.
[/list]

How do you pull that one off? That's like me saying to Mrs. Bonehead, "For our anniversary, I am going on a surfing trip to Costa Rica!

Bonehead

Chief · Dec 17, 2005

Bob,

Not sure if this is in the price range or configuration that you had in mind but Borgford makes both a grapple and a Bucket claw. It would be a matter of adding or plumbing in a 3rd scv. The grapple may not be as practical as it goes in place of the bucket but has its advantages over a bucket claw. The bucket claw is probably the more utilitarian.

http://www.borgford.com/claw.htm

http://www.borgford.com/grapple.htm

Melensdad · Dec 17, 2005

This is the American Solutions Grapple unit.

http://www.amerisolutions.net/grapple.htm

Any thoughts on a mount that could be moved from bucket to bucket?

Chief · Dec 17, 2005

Bob, I think the top of the bucket would not be a practical location to mount the grapple claw as the steel in the area is configured in such a way that the claw mount frame would have a lot of leverage against it and could bend it probably easier than either of us think.

The steel on the bucket sides would support and sustain those load much better. If the claw was mounted to the bucket top, I would think a considerable amount of reinforcement and cost would be involved.

The only other possible option besides a separate claw for each bucket, (and I don't like that option) would be to fabricate a quick release type bucket to FEL mount for the one bucket you will mount the claw on that would allow you to quickly and conveniently mount the claw bucket on both machines. I am not sure how practical that would be and if that would not run into unwanted additional costs.

I am sure there are folks here who have a wealth of welding & hydraulics knowledge who can jump in here and post their ideas.

Melensdad · Dec 17, 2005

There is no way to do a side mount since the buckets are different widths..
Neither bucket is set up with a QA system.
The top of the NH bucket is reinforced with square tube.
The top of the Kubota bucket has a simple roll and is lighter duty.

My thought is that there would need to be 4 total connetion points. A couple points near the bucket's top edge and then a couple more points about a third of the way down the back of the bucket. Probably have to weld a 6" square steel reinforcement plate around each mounting point? Each of the 4 mounting points could be similar to a 'captured' lower link connection point like is found on quality box blades. I could then use "top link pins" to allow for easy change from one tractor bucket to the other.

The Kubota bucket would be the bigger challenge because of its rolled top, it might need to be reinforced across the entire top lip with a piece of tube steel that matched the I.D. of the existing rolled lip?

BoneheadNW said:
How do you pull that one off? That's like me saying to Mrs. Bonehead, "For our anniversary, I am going on a surfing trip to Costa Rica!

Bonehead

Let me know when you are going, I'll join you! :wave:

DaveNay · Dec 17, 2005

Bob, what about modifying the American Solutions grapple so that the long horizontal tube is telescoping on one or both sides. Then the widtch could be adjusted for either bucket. With the side plates firmly bolted to the bucket walls, you wouldn't even need to have pins to hold the telescoping sections.

Melensdad · Dec 18, 2005

Dave, I was beginning to wonder about something like that too, but the torque would make for some stess on that tube. I think if got 2 sections of square tube or better yet rectangular tube, with the I.D. of one just large enough to fit the O.D. of the other, it might work? I prefer to have 'tool free' implement changes, but given the complexity of the twisting stress loads exerted and the different bucket sizes, I'm not sure it could be mounted without bolts.

DaveNay · Dec 18, 2005

B_Skurka said:
Dave, I was beginning to wonder about something like that too, but the torque would make for some stess on that tube. I think if got 2 sections of square tube or better yet rectangular tube, with the I.D. of one just large enough to fit the O.D. of the other, it might work? I prefer to have 'tool free' implement changes, but given the complexity of the twisting stress loads exerted and the different bucket sizes, I'm not sure it could be mounted without bolts.

I agree that you may wish to switch to a two tube design. With two tubes you can stay with square, and they make tubing specifically sized to nest inside another tube (think trailer receiver hitches). I only meant 'tool free' for the telescoping tube members, the end plates would of course still have to be bolted to the walls of the bucket. Actually, if you telescope the tubeing on both ends (so the grapple stays centered) you would need to pin the sections, otherwise the grapple would 'float' (maybe.....I'm not sure how the hydraulic cylider is mounted, that might hold it centered, but not a good loading condition on the cylinder....nevermind)

Kubota King · Dec 18, 2005

This is a bogford grapple & it is truly my favorite attachment! This has saved me sooooo much time & agrivasion. I have looked at many & I believe Bogford makes the best qaulity grapple for the money on the market.

OregonAlex · Dec 19, 2005

I think Bob was looking for something a bit more light duty (i.e. lighter) then the Borgford on this tractors.

btw, Is that photo of the BG-4?

Kubota King · Dec 19, 2005

OregonAlex said:
I think Bob was looking for something a bit more light duty (i.e. lighter) then the Borgford on this tractors.

btw, Is that photo of the BG-4?

Its a BG 5, I have carried large rocks with it, heck I moved 5 full sized telephone poles with it over the summer. They were on a subdivision development that I did alot of work on & the GC asked me if I could move them 1700 feet down the road. It was a scarey task but it got the job done. Light duty or not...Grapple's need to be high quality to stand the abuse they will have to take & you cant go wrong with a Bogford grapple.

OregonAlex · Dec 19, 2005

Kubota King said:
Grapple's need to be high quality to stand the abuse they will have to take & you cant go wrong with a Bogford grapple.

believe me when I tell you that I understand what you are saying. I own a BG-5 on a L3130/LA723 too. I am just pointing out that it looks like Bob is looking for a light duty/light weight solution.

B_Skurka said:
The primary use will be hauling tree prunings and other lightweight (but very thorny) limbs. I do not expect heavy duty use since I'm getting too old, too lazy and am too much of a weenie to do to hard labor.

Kubota King · Dec 19, 2005

oh...ok.

Melensdad · Dec 19, 2005

Alex, you are correct, I am looking for something that is only going to see modest duty, its primary job will be to handle Hawthorn tree prunings. Hawthorn trees as small, rarely reaching 25' with limbs that are brittle, often low slung and rarely more than 2" or 3" in diameter. The thorns are brutal, often reaching 1.5" and razor sharp, easily sharp and tough enough to puncture an R4 tire or the soul of a shoe. Annually I prune these nasty trees back and haul off hundreds of branches to the burn pile.

Those of you who frequented TBN last summer may remember my bloody trip to the hospital due to a thorn that was impaled in my skull! I now wear a Stihl loggers helmet when working around these trees!!!

I don't know if a grapple is the right answer to my needs, but it seems like it might save me a lot of grief???

Junkman · Dec 19, 2005

Bob....... I worked with Jeff from American Solutions on the grapple and I have one installed on my bucket. It is a very easy mount / dis mount system using only two spring loaded clips. He has since changed the hydraulics to the type that Pineridge has on his TN. That is an electric solenoid to move the hydraulic fluid from the tilt to the grapple and back. I am certain that it will work for what you want, but I believe that since your bucket is higher, from the cutting edge to the top of the bucket than the BX bucket, that you would need longer tines. Check with Pineridge as to the grapple that he has for his TN. It might be a better solution for a larger machine like your. Junk....

Dargo · Dec 20, 2005

Junk, that's exactly like what I had in mind!! :a1:

Where'd you get that? Gimme one!

Junkman · Dec 20, 2005

Come over any time and I will load you up. We have lots of rocks that size and larger and won't miss a few if you have a use for them. :coolshade

Grapple: think this would work?

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