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1979 BR-100 hydraulics

PatMcD

New member
Hello, first time to this forum; glad I found it.

My snowmobile club has an option on a 1979 Bombi from another club. They had it set up with a ram-steer drag, but they never really got the hydraulic pump set up correctly. They had it on the deck next to the engine compartment and it kept spitting off the belt (probably from different movement between deck and engine).

They had talked about mounting it to the motor but would need to move the alternator over to the other side, etc., etc.. Seems like there is an easier solution as there are many of these in use with hydraulics hooked up.
All the lines and controls are there in place, it just needs the pump/reservoir added.

Can anybody enlighten me on the correct set-up? maybe some photos?

Thanks very much,
Pat
 

rcc

Member
Not sure but on my BR-100+ the hydraulic pump mounts on the left side of the engine (left as sitting in the cab) but it has the 2.3L the BR-100 has a 1.6L engine. At any rate I cannot imagine how a belt drive could possibly stay aligned with the crankshaft pulley if it is mounted on the tub (body) of the machine as the engine is on rubber mounts. Also sound like a dangerous set up, maybe a good thing it didn't work.

You may want to consider using a 12V hydraulic power pack, this is what I use on my Bombardier J5 to operate the hydraulic dump trailer. Works perfect and you don't need any other tanks, valves etc for the fluid, just use the electric control buttons.
 

PatMcD

New member
I thought a electric/hydraulic pump would be an easy solution, but was told by more than one person that the motor wouldn't last because you are constantly using it with a ram-steer.
 

rcc

Member
I have 2 units on 2 J5's They are installed in a sealed enclosure made for the unit. The first one I had died after one year as it got water / moisture inside and shorted but it was not protected. The 2 in the seal box... not a problem both working good. I will put one on my BR this coming winter to operate a ram steer and see how it holds up.
 

MNoutdoors RIP

Gone But Not Forgotten
GOLD Site Supporter
I thought a electric/hydraulic pump would be an easy solution, but was told by more than one person that the motor wouldn't last because you are constantly using it with a ram-steer.

We have used some self contained 12 volt electric/hydraulic units to provide
Hydraulic steering on some machines and have not had a failure in 7 years of use.

Think about a snowplow power unit they get 10,000's of cycles and they keep going

I have seen some drags with the power unit mounted right on the drag then you just need to run the wiring from the groomer to run it makes it self contained
 

PatMcD

New member
We have one of those DC power units on our big drag for up/down and wheels up/down. Do you think one unit would do that plus ram steer?
 

rcc

Member
Depends on the power units configuration, they come in single acting, double acting and stackable etc... you should consult you local hydraulic specialist, it should not be to hard to find, depending on your location. In Canada, I go to Princess auto they have everything one needs and their specialists I have worked with were very helpful.
 

MNoutdoors RIP

Gone But Not Forgotten
GOLD Site Supporter
We have one of those DC power units on our big drag for up/down and wheels up/down. Do you think one unit would do that plus ram steer?

Not knowing the unit it makes it hard to answer that but if it's there it would not be hard to try it.
 

PatMcD

New member
It's a pretty small unit. Not a huge reservoir. I'd think the fluid would heat up pretty good.

I've got some pictures of the Bombi. As soon as I find an online host for them, I'll post em up.
 

PatMcD

New member
I'm going to back up a little. Now I don't know if this is even a BR-100. It looks just like a regular Bombi I have seen online.
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[URL=http://s1065.photobucket.com/user/patlisamcdPatMcD100/media/20150420_132521_zpsixhauxec.jpg.html]

[IMG]http://i1065.photobucket.com/albums/u400/patlisamcdPatMcD100/20150420_132521_zpsixhauxec.jpg[/URL][/IMG]
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As you might see; all the valves and lines are in place. It just needs a pump added.
 

rcc

Member
Ok, i give, were did they have the pump to work all these nice looking hyd lines?

Regarding the 12V powerpak hyd system, they usually do not need a lot of oil as the flow and stress is very low, it is not a transmission or an excavator. the oil should be between 100F blue line (cool) and 200F redline (very hot). Easy to test, if you are using the ram that much to redline the temp you would most likely be distressing the valve system trying to turn, which is not usually the case. If you do need extra cooling just add an aluminum heat sink or rad style cooler with a temp control stat.
 

rcc

Member
Oh, i forgot the most important part, change the fluid regularly. it is easy and not expensive.
 

PatMcD

New member
They had the pump mounted on the deck next to the motor. It never worked more than a few hours before spitting the belt. Why they had it there, I don't know.
Its not on the machine now. Seems like one could be mounted on the motor under the alternator.
 

PatMcD

New member
A few more pics:

Here's where I see the pump should be added.
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Here's the tag on the motor. Does that read as a 1974, or is there a code for the year?
20150420_131826_zpssi9jt7nv.jpg
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Track cleats look decent.
20150420_132019_zpsqb04ajwx.jpg
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This is what they were using for the ram steer. It's missing the small steering wheel.
20150420_132226_zpsqyjnumnv.jpg
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Controls for drag and wheels.
20150420_132237_zps64mvv6nd.jpg
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Was this small radiator factory or an add-on?
20150420_132430_zpscwq6782p.jpg
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The drag that comes with it.
20150420_132827_zps8i2ldzfw.jpg
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Machine has 1360 hrs on the meter.
 

JimVT

Bronze Member
GOLD Site Supporter
Was this small radiator factory or an add-on?
that looks like the factory one that mounts on the engine radiator .do the lines run to your steering gearbox?
 

PatMcD

New member
Was this small radiator factory or an add-on?
that looks like the factory one that mounts on the engine radiator .do the lines run to your steering gearbox?

Not my machine yet. I didn't look it over all that well to see where the lines run.
 
The Bombi had an engine driven hydraulic pump as an option. It mounted just as you are suggesting and driven off of that second pulley on the crank shaft. I believe it was a 2gpm pump that is readily available from a supplier. I had the all the factory hydraulics except the pump in a basket case Bombi I had bought many years ago. All the parts are visible in the Bombi parts book.

I did use the electric driven pump set up in another Bombi I had to run a homemade plow set up. I didn't like it that much as it is either full on or full off. No gentle feeding of the hydraulics like with a pump driven set up. It did not have a float capability and it was hard on the electrical system and if you were to do it right, it might require an extra battery and somehow isolate it from the chassis electrical system so your lights didn't dim every time you activated the pump. I think by using the electric pump it would be a very jerky steering system but I have been wrong on several occasions before!
 

PatMcD

New member
I went and looked at a few other clubs' bombi's and how they were set up.
Basically just a simple pump mounted to a bracket under the alternator.
 

rcc

Member
You could use a bracket and power steering pump from a Ford car or truck with the same engine and it would work just fine. If you feel you need more oil add a small tank, but i don't think it would be required.
I have the hydraulic pump model and specs for my 1994 BR100+ back at the cottage if you want it, we will be back up there in a few days.
 
You could use a bracket and power steering pump from a Ford car or truck with the same engine and it would work just fine. If you feel you need more oil add a small tank, but i don't think it would be required.
I have the hydraulic pump model and specs for my 1994 BR100+ back at the cottage if you want it, we will be back up there in a few days.

That might work, I would think it depends on how many cylinders and the difference in volume of the in stroke vs. the out stroke on if you would need a reservoir.
 

rcc

Member
The factory hydraulic pump on the BR-100+ is a Webster 29YB series gear pump 2 US gal per min @ 1650 RPM (100psi) Operating pressure is 2000psi V-belt drive.

From what I have found the most auto power steering pumps are around 3 gal/min @ 1000 - 1300 psi. some can be adjust by changing the spring in the relief valve.
 
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