Europe Wants America Weakened? International FF Members, What Say You?

From Boortz.com

Thursday, July 24, 2008

IF WE LET EUROPE DECIDE
To say that Europeans are fond of Barack Obama would be an understatement. It seems that he has reached the same level of adulation and worship as he has in the United States. So when asked who Europeans would prefer to see elected as the next US president, it is no surprise that citizens of France, Germany and the UK all chose Barack Obama ... by a landslide. In the UK, Obama was favored 60-15. In France, 64-4. And in Germany, they chose Barack Obama by a margin of 62-10 over John McCain. Frankly, I'm surprised that the numbers were this low.

Now if it were up to people like Barack Obama, the opinions of these foreign countries would matter. Remember Obama's thermostat comment ... "We can't drive our SUVs and eat as much as we want and keep our homes on 72 degrees at all times ... and then just expect that other countries are going to say OK." What does it matter what other countries think about our habits? In fact, what business is it of our president? But the Europeans sure can't wait for this guy to be in power.

Now here's something that you won't hear from any of the networks when it comes to analyzing the European infatuation over Obama. Several months ago the Pew Research Center did some polling in Europe. That polling showed that 58 percent of Europeans want the United States to be weakened. They want a weaker America. Oddly, that 58 percent figure is pretty close to the margin for Obama. So how are you going to feel about European attitudes about our presidential election if you walk up to someone on the street and have this dialogue:
Does anyone care to look into the motives behind this European love affair with The Messiah?

I think the motives are clear.

What? No comments from across the pond? Should I consider a lack of denial an agreement with the assumption above?

Cityboy said:

Should I consider a lack of denial an agreement with the assumption above?

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Negative logic is a dark and slippery slope.

I'm up in Canada now and it appears that Obama is a slam dunk up here. They are in love with him. I'm not surprised though. The media up here is more biased and even less professional than the media in the US.

Obama will cause more division in the USA, he is to left for some in America.

PBinWA said:

The media up here is more biased and even less professional than the media in the US.

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Holy shit!!!! I didn't think that was possible. They must be a really sorry bunch of ........ (I only did that to save the mods the trouble of deleting this post).

i dont have much of an a opinion on the guy to be honest(the Muslim stuff i read is my concern)....i think all that run to try and make it to President in your country were weak.....none seem to have have the back bone or stood out....McCain would get my vote....and even that im not fully sold on.

At the end of the day i have no say who runs your country it's down to your people....and if they vote him in you can blame yourselves not me when it all goes tit's up......just like here after years of Labour our country is screwed...the British voters fault no-one else.

And to be honest what ever reports you are getting back in the USA are maybe a little over the top by the media....i heard a small whisper he was visiting the UK....as i say a small whisper...our media never really made anything of his visit....i for one dont even know what day he was here....as i say he aint my problem.

As for wanting America to be weaker that sounds like paranoia creeping in.....i prefer my Allies in a strong and healthy state.

good luck with your new President

Damn you Cityboy i hate politics.

Galvatron said:

As for wanting America to be weaker that sounds like paranoia creeping in.....i prefer my Allies in a strong and healthy state.

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I will second that, but you must also understand Americans seem to love to be hated.

Galvatron said:

As for wanting America to be weaker that sounds like paranoia creeping in.....i prefer my Allies in a strong and healthy state.

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That makes sense. But in your conversations with others, what is their opinion and attitude toward the U.S.?

daedong said:

I will second that, but you must also understand Americans seem to love to be hated.

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Clearly things are not as they seem. What I'm looking to accomplish with this thread is to obtain some sincere observations from our international members. I read the article I posted and wondered if it was true.

I wonder do people in other countries want to see the United States "put in its place", or is that just a paranoid position of the right wing conservative media here? Remember, the article is simply the opinion of one of many conservative talk show hosts, however, Neal Boortz tends to be Libertarian in his views, so I pay a little bit of attention to him. I'm not defending the article, just seeking clarification.

I want to get away from gross generalizations like "all Europeans dislike Americans....." because we all know that is untrue and downright silly. But what I would like to know is the prevailing attitude of the majority of our international allies. And..does that prevailing attitude include the opinion that the United States is too powerful and deserves to be, shall we say "knocked down a notch ot two?"

Cityboy said:

I want to get away from gross generalizations like "all Europeans dislike Americans....." because we all know that is untrue and downright silly. But what I would like to know is the prevailing attitude of the majority of our international allies. And..does that prevailing attitude include the opinion that the United States is too powerful and deserves to be, shall we say "knocked down a notch ot two?"

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I'm going to go out on a limb here and extrapolate some of my observations from when I visited China in 2001 (just 5 days after 9/11).

There seems to be a common misunderstanding regarding how the people of one country regard the people of another. It seems to me that there is a huge difference between the opinions of a countries government and a countries citizens. When I visited China, we were in the middle of a very unique and probably un-repeatable set of circumstances. Most everyone has forgotten about the US spy plane that was taken by China in the summer of 2001. This was causing very significant strained relations between China and the US. Most everyone that I talked with prior to my vacation expressed concern that I was going to experience difficulty in China due to these issues. Then when 9/11 happened, there was of course the global show of support for the US, including from China. Throughout all of this, I maintained that these were the opinions and views of the Chinese government and the US government, and not the people of both countries.

I was proved right. Throughout my three weeks in China, I did not experience even one single bit of disrespect towards me because I am a US citizen. Every single person I spoke with (and I went out of my way to speak with anyone I could find) was exactly like you and me. They went to work, they raised a family, they worried about "making ends meet" and they were generally friendly to strangers and visitors. Everyone that I ever spoke with about the spy plane dismissed it as "that's the government for you". Every single person that I spoke with about 9/11 would offer their sympathy to me and my country. Some with a tear in their eye, and some with a hug.

Like I said, these are simply my observations, and aren't even about Europeans, but I do believe the priciple holds true.

Cityboy, any knowledgeable Australian knows that it is in the interest of this country to have a strong diplomatic relationship with the USA, they also would acknowledge that the prosperity of the USA is just as important.

"but you must also understand Americans seem to love to be hated."

Perhaps I should rephrase that to "Americans seem to love to think you are hated".

To answer your first question. Of course I can't answer for Europeans, and it is possible that America is viewed quite differently here than in Europe, but I can't ever recall any conversations about wanting to see America "put in its place". Sounds like paranoia to me. (Refer quote above)

DaveNay said:

I'm going to go out on a limb here and extrapolate some of my observations from when I visited China in 2001 (just 5 days after 9/11).

There seems to be a common misunderstanding regarding how the people of one country regard the people of another. It seems to me that there is a huge difference between the opinions of a countries government and a countries citizens. When I visited China, we were in the middle of a very unique and probably un-repeatable set of circumstances. Most everyone has forgotten about the US spy plane that was taken by China in the summer of 2001. This was causing very significant strained relations between China and the US. Most everyone that I talked with prior to my vacation expressed concern that I was going to experience difficulty in China due to these issues. Then when 9/11 happened, there was of course the global show of support for the US, including from China. Throughout all of this, I maintained that these were the opinions and views of the Chinese government and the US government, and not the people of both countries.

I was proved right. Throughout my three weeks in China, I did not experience even one single bit of disrespect towards me because I am a US citizen. Every single person I spoke with (and I went out of my way to speak with anyone I could find) was exactly like you and me. They went to work, they raised a family, they worried about "making ends meet" and they were generally friendly to strangers and visitors. Everyone that I ever spoke with about the spy plane dismissed it as "that's the government for you". Every single person that I spoke with about 9/11 would offer their sympathy to me and my country. Some with a tear in their eye, and some with a hug.

Like I said, these are simply my observations, and aren't even about Europeans, but I do believe the priciple holds true.

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I experienced the same thing in Japan, Korea an The Phillipines long before 9/11. But....you must also understand Asian culture. They may have been making fun of you in a dialect you could not understand.. ..although maybe not with the world sympathy we experienced during that time....

When I was in Japan in the mid 80's, a buddy I ran with spoke fluent Japanese in several dialects because his Father was career Air Force and spent 10+ years in Japan. This guy learned the language and educated himself in their culture, knew how to dress, what to say, how to say it and who to say it to. He had a harem of Japanese women! Anyway, he told me that the Japanese frequently talked of "stupid Americans" among themselves right on front of American customers. One night, out in a bar, he overheard the Japanese bartender berating us to another bar employee, unbeknownst to me. My buddy cut loose in Japanese on this lady! I have no clue what he said, but apologies were made, and a $100 bottle of scotch appeared on our table gratis.

The point is that if you do not understand the language, you have no clue what someone might be saying. No everyone of course, but it is apparently quite common.

daedong said:

To answer your first question. Of course I can't answer for Europeans, and it is possible that America is viewed quite differently here than in Europe, but I can't ever recall any conversations about wanting to see America "put in its place". Sounds like paranoia to me. (Refer quote above)

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spot on Vin....i can honestly say i have never been in a conversation with any one here in the UK where it has been mentioned that the USA needs putting in it's place....to be honest i dont think i have ever come across anyone thats anti America.

I for one have my hands full disliking the French....got no time to dislike you guys

Cityboy said:

The point is that if you do not understand the language, you have no clue what someone might be saying. No everyone of course, but it is apparently quite common.

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daedong said:

Perhaps I should rephrase that to "Americans seem to love to think you are hated".

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You are tilting at windmills here Mr. Quixote.

DaveNay said:

You are tilting at windmills here Mr. Quixote.

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Oh yeah? Well how's this Mr. Wannabe Sancho Panza.

About the only comments going round about America at the moment is on the lines of when the hell are you going to have an election and get this whole circus finished , it's been going on for months and you're still no closer to an election . We have 6 or 8 weeks from when an elections called till when it's done and dusted with a new PM or Premier (national or state) but you guy's seem to be having a super expensive campaign process to decide who the candidate is before you even get there . When is the actual election anyway ? Most people down here have little or no interest in who's up for the election or what it means to America's future , they are more interested in watching the fights and scandals getting them there .

sports850 said:

About the only comments going round about America at the moment is on the lines of when the hell are you going to have an election and get this whole circus finished , it's been going on for months and you're still no closer to an election . We have 6 or 8 weeks from when an elections called till when it's done and dusted with a new PM or Premier (national or state) but you guy's seem to be having a super expensive campaign process to decide who the candidate is before you even get there . When is the actual election anyway ? Most people down here have little or no interest in who's up for the election or what it means to America's future , they are more interested in watching the fights and scandals getting them there .

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November 11th if I can read a calendar and remember anything from 7th Grade civics and senior government....

Edit... I was wrong. It's the fourth.. for some reason I was thinking second Tuesday in November rather than the first.....

They dont want another ass-clown as our President.

Think about it: As long as America prospers and stays strong, the rest of the world can count on being inundated with our resources, both physical and financial, in times of natural disaster. If we fall, who then will come to their aid?

Trakternut said:

Think about it: As long as America prospers and stays strong, the rest of the world can count on being inundated with our resources, both physical and financial, in times of natural disaster. If we fall, who then will come to their aid?

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T-Nut, I hear what you are saying, but sometimes statements like that can come across as arrogant. There needs to come a point on this planet when the divisiveness ends between nations...especially allied nations... and we all realize our survival depends on interdependance with other nations. There may just come a time when we need help, and if we have demonstrated arrogance to those we once helped, they may choose to let us learn a painful lesson.

That's something to ponder.

Cityboy said:

T-Nut, I hear what you are saying, but sometimes statements like that can come across as arrogant. There needs to come a point on this planet when the divisiveness ends between nations...especially allied nations... and we all realize our survival depends on interdependance with other nations. There may just come a time when we need help, and if we have demonstrated arrogance to those we once helped, they may choose to let us learn a painful lesson.

That's something to ponder.

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You're right. I didn't intend to sound arrogant. I'm just stating a fact. I don't belittle the efforts other countries put into disaster aid. I believe in being allies with as many other nations as we can. It's mutually beneficial. Seems like dang near ever scrap we've been in for a long time back, we've always got the Canadians and the British helping us out.
If we hadn't tag-teamed with the Brits, there's two occasions where the French could have had to learn German!

Oh, yeah, I apologize for forgetting onr other contributor that pitches in rather handily. The Aussies! They're good folks to have on our side too. Thanks, Aussies! Good on ya Mates!

Countries that speak English oddly are good friends

Deadly Sushi said:

Countries that speak English oddly are good friends

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I know Americans that speaks English 'oddly'....

And yes, most of our 'scraps' would be hard without help. Even Rambo could be brought down with enough 5th grade kids. Like Galvatron said, why would our allies want us to be weak? If I get in a fight, I want all my 'friends' helping me to be in top shape.