Trails in Southern Wyoming area

Cletis said:

Just throwing out as many suggestions as I possibly could. That's why I posted all the map trails. As I said earlier, last year, during the week days I was totally alone. I didn't even hear a sled, but that may not be the norm. mbsieg has much more knowledge than myself about the mt during winter. Let me know where you decide and what I can do to help.

Cletis

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ya but as I personally know all it takes is one...

Thanks a lot I have found some of those too

dds said:

Come north Kirk you can drive any place you want to I have 2 cats now

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This too shall happen in good time. Just not this winter. I'm on a short rein right now....

Thanks, Kirk

My second reply from the NPS.

They certainly are insistent that private snow cats are not allowed, but do not want to show me the actual rules.

Good day.

The use of private snowcats or snowcoaches is prohibited in Yellowstone. Only permitted commercial guides may use snowcoaches in the park.

Beginning the winter of 2014-15 there is the possibility of obtaining a permit for doing a non-commercial snowmobile tour of the park. Those will not be allowed this coming winter. Though visitors may enter unguided on snowmobile beginning 2014-15 they will be required to have a permit and use best available technology snowmobiles.

New winter use rules governing oversnow vehicle travel go into effect beginning the winter 2014-15. In those rules and the current rules there is no allowance for the use of private snowcoaches.

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From reading the link Cletus provided, I would say the the Park management is in bed with the concessionaires. How else to explain that the only way to prevent wildlife harassment is by requiring guides? How about education, and law enforcement?

http://www.yellowstonegate.com/2013...-plan-moves-ahead-with-park-service-decision/


I have no idea what trails the currently run on in the park in the winter now, but wouldn't it be much simpler to allow the road open N&S and E&W for snowmobiles and snow coaches and fine any that wander even slightly from those roads? I have no issue with a speed limit or noise reduction. heck they are on you like flys now when ever wildlife gets too close to auto traffic. Realizing that winter is more stressful on wildlife

Cletis

Will be real interesting to see how these "transportation events" will be regulated.
I personally would like to see them allow private cats. I'd really like to go through the park in the winter at least once.


Cletis

check and see what the forest service or park has for a description of snowmobile.
then the requirments of running one. it takes lots of work sometimes and try to see it written down someplace.

While I would of consider a trip through Yellow Stone, it is not nessary we try that this year. Looks to me like the rules are evolving as they go. Maybe in future years it would be more likely...I'm just happy any where we land that has good snow and some nice landscapes to look at!! I think this winter we should keep it simple, and maybe then while we are together work out future plans?? JMHO..

Regards, Kirk

Oh no, I wasn't thinking this year, but sure would like to do it some day.

I haven't said anymore about the trip this year as the only area I know is the southern Big Horns and Pinedale area a little. I don't know the Wy, Co border area.

How many day deal are we talking?

Cletis

I am game for 3-4 days of running.. Any less than 3 and it really is questionable if it would be worth the drive. I just hope my machine is in a good of shape as I think it is. Need some different carb jets if we get really high in altitude. I need to plan ahead a bit, and get prepared for such....

Regards, Kirk

3-4 works for me also.

I meant to ask about the jetting and forgot. I rode around last yr between 7500k and 9000k +. Southern Big Horns.

No idea what down south is.

Cletis

The south looks to be 7,000 - 10,000 ft.

The south area's around Laramie are quite a bit closer to me than the I90 corridor to the North. If we decide to stay to the south of course...

MAD posted on page 2 about what is in the South of The Medicine bows, were I have snowmobiled before.

How bout it MAD any thing else you would like to add about the area north of Walden Co.??

MAD said:

South end of snowy range 22 miles to Walden co and miles of trails some lodging on the mountain depending on numbers. 60 miles to the springs at Saratoga

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Surley there is more to add to this. Tell us more of the area. With a small group, lodging probably isn't an issue.

Regards, Kirk

MAD said:

South end of snowy range 22 miles to Walden co and miles of trails some lodging on the mountain depending on numbers. 60 miles to the springs at Saratoga

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Any more info? anyone have on the ground info. FS roads trails? Best area? Lodging?

300 H and H said:

Surley there is more to add to this. Tell us more of the area. With a small group, lodging probably isn't an issue.

Regards, Kirk

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Small group?????? I am holding out for 25-30 cats!!!!!

And Boggie better show up......

















































With spare parts....

If we are looking at Wyoming and the snowy range I can get us around the south end of the range and northern Colorado and might have room for cat parking but can only house a couple of folks. would depend on the time of year and snow conditions. I have not had any success with permitting events from the forest service side so would need a good head count. Might be able to come up with additional places to stay if needed. Our cat is older and goes without saying is a project at times but sounds like fun.

what areas are we talking? are there a lot of forest service roads in the area? Do you know the area well? Is there anything to do other than snocatting in the area? lodging close by? What are the snow depth of this area and the winter?

It's been over 10 years since I've been snowmobiling in Yellowstone, and the rules have become more and more restrictive seemingly every year. That said, there are more miles of trails in the West Yellowstone, MT area outside the park than inside.

My experience (been three times) was in the park the "trail" is the same paved road everyone drives their cars, etc on in the summer. Even ten years ago it was forbidden to go off the trail, and if you got caught - it was a major deal.

IIRC entering at West Yellowstone, "making the loop" and returning was right at 140 miles. The trail could be miserably rough, even though it was groomed every night. We saw a ton of wildlife, especially Bison and Elk, and of course Old Faithful as well as the Grand Canyon of Yellowstone. I was advised the best time of year (in terms of fewest visitors and decent snow) was early January. It was cold but not crowded. West Yellowstone is a neat spot. The streets are plowed, but snow covered and people will drive their sleds on the streets to go grab a beer or food, etc.

Some ideas for you:

1.) The West Yellowstone Chamber of Commerce is a fantastic resource. They are very familiar with the park rules, and can provide you with all kinds of worthwhile information and recommendations. If they don't know the answer they would know who to ask...

2.) I think its about 40 miles or so NE of Jackson, WY, but there's a place called Togwotee Mountain Lodge (pronounced Tow-ga-tee). They get a ton of snow, and have snow when it seems no place else does. There's a motel with a restaurant and a bunch of cabins with cooking facilities. In the winter time it's all about snowmobiling, with some groomed trails that they groom (and connect to the Continental Divide trail system). There are also quite a few areas to go off trail or "play". I was there 2001ish and it was incredibly awesome. I wouldn't hesitate to call them and see how receptive they'd be to some guys with Sno-Cats. They also sell gasoline at a small convenience store at the resort (at least they did back then).

I snowmobile a fair amount in Utah and I'm on the same page as Shortbus. If you are on a trail you (and you alone) are responsible for your speed. There is absolutely no guarantee you're not going to meet someone going the other way. Many times I've been snowmobiling and come upon a groomer operated by the state of Utah. It's also not uncommon to find people X-C skiing on the groomed trails, though that's usually fairly close to the trail head.

If the Tucker project is done I'd love to join you...

Blackfoot,

Get'er done man, we'd love to have you along!!!

Regards, Kirk

All
Happy to help put something together for the range if that is the choice of the group. Please check out the area around Mountain Home WY for trail availability. sled traffic has been slow the last few years. not sure what he average travel for day might be but tell me and I will do some additional scouting this weekend.
Mike

For me 40-50 miles would do nicely. Not sure about every one else. Averaging 8mph would get this done in about 5-6 hours. I am not sure we could average 8 mph climbing...My experiance is in the flats, and 8 mph could easily be done, more like 10-12mph is do able. In mountains I am sure it would be substantialy less, maybe less than 8mph..

What is there for lodging? Night life?

Regards, Kirk

300 H and H said:

For me 40-50 miles would do nictake Not sure about every one else. Averaging 8mph would get this done in about 5-6 hours. I am not sure we could average 8 mph climbing...My experiance is in the flats, and 8 mph could easily be done, more like 10-12mph is do able. In mountains I am sure it would be substantialy less, maybe less than 8mph..

What is there for lodging? Night life?

Regards, Kirk

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My guess 20 miles in a day would be tops. Breaking trail takes time. Heck I rarely ever put 50 miles on a sled in a day out here. Unless you are trail riding. Playing in meadows is fun with a cat also. I would reccomend 2-3 hr drive 1 hr more or less lunch 2-3 hr drive back. There will be king of the hill contests bet you can't make it through there contests and such. Got to remember if it is a good snow year we could be looking at 8-10 feet of snow in the snowies. That equals a few sticks. And breaking a lot of trails.

mbsieg said:

My guess 20 miles in a day would be tops. Breaking trail takes time. Heck I rarely ever put 50 miles on a sled in a day out here. Unless you are trail riding. Playing in meadows is fun with a cat also. I would reccomend 2-3 hr drive 1 hr more or less lunch 2-3 hr drive back. There will be king of the hill contests bet you can't make it through there contests and such. Got to remember if it is a good snow year we could be looking at 8-10 feet of snow in the snowies. That equals a few sticks. And breaking a lot of trails.

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Now that is why I would like to go with others. In my neck of the woods it is pretty easy to put more than 100 miles on in a day. With trails or just road ditches, and open farm fields.

I certainly would not know what to exect from a cat in your area. I have alot to learn.

Regards, Kirk

MSB I like the logic of your description 2-3 hrs out 2-3 hrs back. if folks don't want to see if they can climb then they can partner up and continue breaking trail.... If some one breaks down it is nice to budget a bit of time for courtesy fixing....

Kirk I had to read your last line twice....
I certainly would not know what to exect from a cat in your area.

I thought that said I would not know how to extract a cat in your area......

"hey lets cross this creek" can lead to 2-3 hrs of fun in itself ;-)

In regards to schedule. Im out before 12/16. then good till (2/8 - 2/20) great after that with mid march the best.

Headed up Friday for the long weekend will take the jeep out and do some additional exploring and talk with the local lodging options and see what they think. I will see what I can find from 30 to 50 miles.

Lyndon showed me a picture of when he took a bombi and snow trac into the park.
i think he said he went 50 miles.
jim

I think 50 miles in the park on groomed trails would be pretty easy. No breaking trails, as they are already there. I don't think they would let you go off trail, even back when Lyndon was there.

When the smoke at the park service clears, maybe there will be a way to get in. Mean while we can just hope.

MAD, I look forward to hearing about your scouting trip. Keep is updated.

Regards, Kirk