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In cold weather COTTON clothing can kill you!

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
Folks, be careful outside when the temps are near, or below freezing.

I'm constantly amazed at the people out in the cold who are wearing cotton. Among the hiking/backpacking community you hear the mantra: COTTON KILLS.

Here is a story about three guys who went out into the woods in North Carolina and almost died ==> Special N.C. rescue team to extract hikers with chopper from national park » Knoxville News Sentinel
...A specialized team from North Carolina will use a helicopter to extract three distressed hikers from the Great Smoky Mountains National Park.

“Responding rangers are stabilizing the men in the field with dry clothing, sleeping bags and shelter,” said Kent Cave, supervisory ranger with the National Park.

Cave said the men “are being treated for hypothermia and possible frostbite,” He described the hikers as “very weak” and unable to walk.

Cave identified the men as Shawn Hood, Steven White and Jonathan Dobbins, all from Gaffney, S.C. He said the men range in age from 21 to 32.

Cave said authorities are developing plans to use a Helicopter and Aquatic Rescue Team of North Carolina National Guard and State Highway Patrol members trained in difficult rescues to remove the trio. The rescue from the Molly’s Ridge area of the Appalachian Trail is planned for Friday afternoon.

Cave said the hikers were found “some five miles from the nearest trailhead” in rugged terrain.

The men used cell phones Thursday night to request help after they realized they were unprepared for the harsh conditions that hit the region.

Rangers embarked at 3:30 a.m. Friday for the area about five miles from Fontana Dam where the spotty cell phone service indicated the hikers had stopped. They had not made it to the shelter on Molly’s Ridge.

Park rangers on Friday morning found the endangered hikers about 8 a.m.

Cave said the trio of men were conscious but cold when rangers found them on the North Carolina side of the park.

Cave said the rangers left with fresh, weather-appropriate clothing for the hikers, who had embarked on a 10-day hike wearing cotton attire, which is not suited for wet, cold conditions...

The story clearly says they were wearing cotton. Probably blue jeans, cotton pullover shirts, etc. These guys almost died. They got lucky and a rescue team saved them. But they couldn't walk when found.

Wear WOOL or wear some of the high priced/high tech materials to keep you warm and dry in the winter when the weather is extreme. Wear layers so you can strip them off or layer up, depending on your activity level and outdoor conditions. Cotton, when wet, can actually freeze to your skin, it offers ZERO insulation value when it absorbs sweat from the inside or rain/snow/ice from the outside.
 

MNoutdoors RIP

Gone But Not Forgotten
GOLD Site Supporter
Real men choose wool, nothing sheepish about it.:brows:remember I used to live in Montana where men are men and (you know the rest )
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
Real men choose wool, nothing sheepish about it.:brows:remember I used to live in Montana where men are men and (you know the rest )
Unfortunately wool is shockingly expensive. Merino wool undies/baselayers can easily cost $60 for a shirt and $80 is not uncommon. Finding them on sale at $40 to $50 is not too hard if you don't mind odd colors or black. Same with baselayer pants.

Of course there are shell pants too, those can run big bucks too. Its so much cheaper to buy a pair of Levi's and that is why so many people venture out in cotton. Ever priced Filson wool pants??? Better have a "credit line" account for your house to afford a pair of those. Synthetic shell pants, with insulation, can be almost as expensive.

And to make matters worse, outdoor stores like R.E.I or Eastern Mountain Sports as well as DICKS sell cotton shirts and pants for hiking. . . but inexperienced people may not realize those clothes are not for WINTER hiking/camping/backpacking. And clerks are often less than useless with their recommendations.
 

undy

New member
Military surplus dealers frequently still carry wool garments pretty cheap. Otherwise, I've found ebay to be a good place to find lightly used technical clothing cheaply.
 

XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq

Master of Distraction
Staff member
SUPER Site Supporter
We have Columbia Outlet Stores in Oregon, I picked up some awesome Wool camo coveralls for $35 last august.

Otherwise, some of the new base stuff from Under Armor is pretty nice too.
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
SierraTradingPost.com often has good deals but supplies/sizes/colors are limited because they close-out inventory.

By the way, thanks for the endorsement of Steep & Cheep. I've heard about them before. Just ordered 4 shirts to give them a try.
 

Snowtrac Nome

member formerly known as dds
GOLD Site Supporter
just remember when working around fuel that nylon and poly pro can also kill you as it conduct static something terrible. than once you catch fire it just melts down to your skin. I live and work in the arctic and I just carry a change of clothes I try to stay away from synthetics I don't like static in dry air. mother nature has provided me with some of the best stuff like fur for my heads and traditional pull over Eskimo parkas .
 

MNoutdoors RIP

Gone But Not Forgotten
GOLD Site Supporter
just remember when working around fuel that nylon and poly pro can also kill you as it conduct static something terrible. than once you catch fire it just melts down to your skin. I live and work in the arctic and I just carry a change of clothes I try to stay away from synthetics I don't like static in dry air. mother nature has provided me with some of the best stuff like fur for my heads and traditional pull over Eskimo parkas .

What's the going rate on a Eskimo Parka these days ? Maybe I'll trade you some
2100 parts they have the mukluks also?
 

bczoom

Super Moderator
Staff member
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By the way, thanks for the endorsement of Steep & Cheep. I've heard about them before. Just ordered 4 shirts to give them a try.
I've been using them for years and have never been disappointed. Don't forget to use the "Hold my Order" option (if you're not in a hurry) to get combined shipping.
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
I looked up a bunch of reports on this one, and I am amazed at the whole thing.

Concerning shelter, in the long video interview I found, they made it clear they didn't have any. When they stopped and huddled down, they used their sleeping bags draped over a branch as a shelter. Yep, you heard that right, they didn't get in their bags, they hung them out as makeshift tarps....and then proceeded to burn their jackets and clothing rather than putting them on.


So, the summary is:
Head out in for a ten days, in January, in the Smokies, wearing cotton, only expecting daytime temps of 40-50F, with no shelter of any kind, carrying mostly canned food, and only a plumbers torch for heat and cooking.

And the upshot? They said they planned it for months, and were "Prepared for the forecast weather"
 

MNoutdoors RIP

Gone But Not Forgotten
GOLD Site Supporter
I looked up a bunch of reports on this one, and I am amazed at the whole thing.

Concerning shelter, in the long video interview I found, they made it clear they didn't have any. When they stopped and huddled down, they used their sleeping bags draped over a branch as a shelter. Yep, you heard that right, they didn't get in their bags, they hung them out as makeshift tarps....and then proceeded to burn their jackets and clothing rather than putting them on.


So, the summary is:
Head out in for a ten days, in January, in the Smokies, wearing cotton, only expecting daytime temps of 40-50F, with no shelter of any kind, carrying mostly canned food, and only a plumbers torch for heat and cooking.

And the upshot? They said they planned it for months, and were "Prepared for the forecast weather"


I can not feel sorry for them at this point. Unless they had gone so hypothermic
That did not know what they were doing.

I used to drive my mother crazy on my summer and sometimes mid winter vacations I would go on 2-3 week survival trip (summer ) by myself walking from home with what I could carry taking food but not using it unless I absolutely had to Eating from what the land would provide. After just a few days you adapt to the land. But I have studied survival and was intrigued by it from a very early age.
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
I can not feel sorry for them at this point. Unless they had gone so hypothermic
That did not know what they were doing. . .

Far too often, people who survive these "adventures" are described as heroes just because they survived some debacle of their own making, usually saved by the extraordinary efforts of strangers; no, they are not heroes, they are morons. They claim they checked the weather, but didn't have rain gear, a stove or a tent and the forecast was for rain. One said they would be prepared next time; why not this time? Why not turn back when the going got tough?

A few years ago, a Meet Up group in Seattle wound up in similar circumstances due to the inexperience of the group and the stupidity of the leader, who did not check the weather before leading them into the worst storm to hit the PNW in years. A massive SAR effort including helos, snowmachines, ambulances, dozens of SAR pros and volunteers saved them.

They were within a day of two of all dying from exposure - they had lost most of their shelters, had wet sleeping bags, wet clothes (including jeans and cotton hoodies) ran out of food, had no snowshoes or skis and no PLB, Spot or other rescue gadget. Yet, after all that. some of them posted on a PNW website that it was no big deal and a great adventure. They had learned nothing and took no responsibility for the danger in which they had put themselves and their rescuers.

People get killed on SAR missions. I know they are volunteers or choose it as a career, but still, needlessly endangering others because of stupidity doesn't sit well with me.

FYI, I know people take risks; I've taken them myself and done things that if anything had gone wrong, I would have been killed. But, going out completely unprepared is stupid, plain and simple.

Two of my favorite quotes-

"Adventure is just bad planning." — Roald Amundsen (1872—1928). Led the first expedition to the South Pole.

"Having an adventure shows that someone is incompetent, that something has gone wrong. An adventure is interesting enough — in retrospect. Especially to the person who didn't have it." — Vilhjalmur Stefansson, My Life with the Esquimo.
 

Snowtrac Nome

member formerly known as dds
GOLD Site Supporter
What's the going rate on a Eskimo Parka these days ? Maybe I'll trade you some
2100 parts they have the mukluks also?
If you want a parka and hat I have a friend who's wife does some good sewing I will have to check and see if she also has patterns for seal skin Mukluks in the interior where my wifes mother lives they use moose hide.
 

MNoutdoors RIP

Gone But Not Forgotten
GOLD Site Supporter
If you want a parka and hat I have a friend who's wife does some good sewing I will have to check and see if she also has patterns for seal skin Mukluks in the interior where my wifes mother lives they use moose hide.

Thanks, just let me know what they want for set a picture of a similar would be nice before ordering. Do they still chew them to make the leather soft?

I have a beaver fur hat now and unless it's really cold it way to warm.
 

MNoutdoors RIP

Gone But Not Forgotten
GOLD Site Supporter
This style expedition mukluks are made in Minnesota but not a nice as some of the native ones
 

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