• Please be sure to read the rules and adhere to them. Some banned members have complained that they are not spammers. But they spammed us. Some even tried to redirect our members to other forums. Duh. Be smart. Read the rules and adhere to them and we will all get along just fine. Cheers. :beer: Link to the rules: https://www.forumsforums.com/threads/forum-rules-info.2974/

Astro van cat conversion

undy

New member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

The front bogie is on a slide tube and I do not have the exact travel run out.
It'd need to move 1/2 the length of track pitch, minimum. That way you'll adjust one full grouser space, minimum. You need at least that much movement, and can make larger length adjustments by adding or removing a grouser (and belting).
 
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Measured summer tracks and they are 35-3/4" to 36" wide. No offset on drive sprockets so it's 104-7/8" wide.
 
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Here is the layout subframe of the 1200C.
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    103.4 KB · Views: 397

Snowtrac Nome

member formerly known as dds
GOLD Site Supporter
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

might I make a suggestion try to pickup a 2100 ,and cut off the outside belts. you might find the full tub of a 2100 easier to adapt to ,rather than trying to adapt to the lattice frame of a sprite. and 2100' can be had on the cheap
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Been looking at all the options as they pop up, and I still come back to building an all new frame from the giddyup go.

My main concern is getting the basic dimensions so I can design the new frame to accept the 3 foot tracks and allow either the C4 OR OC 12 diffy to fit.

Now, if a 2100 comes creeping into my life I will certainly welcome it with open arms.


So far everything I have seen around here are piles of rusty scrap metal with huge price tags attached.

Or operational machines with even bigger price tags :sad:

My building budget is very minimal.

I buy a pile of goodies, then sell off what I don't need, then recycle the $$$$$$ again and again.

Right now my focus is back to the engine/power pack.

The S10 heap came with a nice tranny and a junk engine (engine will Work well for fitting things up)

The Van runs sweet and only has 125k on the clock, so I am thinking about leaving the engine, tranny and T case as a complete package and selling it for some good $$$$$$$$

I found a 94 4.3 V6 that runs good but it was in a truck that lost the tranny.

I can get the engine for $150.

Thinking..... (I know, that's dangerous)

Pick up the 94 engine and check it out, get it converted to use the Edelbrock carb and the old style HEI.

Get it running on a test stand and get the tranny from the S10 I just bought all spiffy (I used to run a small tranny shop years ago, so I will do the bench work)

Mate the engine and tranny and then I can keep the van intact until the last minute before tearing it apart.

Also can demo the van (engine tranny operating) and arrange a good sale.

Running and "touchy feely" sells better than DEAD in the corner.


Things are still in a state of flux (Normal eh) :ermm:


Until winter fades away things seem to be slow in popping up.

As yet no real promising leads on much other than the track I mentioned.

All the ideas and suggestions are appreciated.

I need a "Go find me" a snow cat page maybe:clap:
 

Snowtrac Nome

member formerly known as dds
GOLD Site Supporter
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

for some reason 2100's seem limited this year in years past I seen some nice specimens out on the east coast for the 3 to 4 grand running price they have super duty axles and the oc-12 if you remove the out side band you will be at about 9 feet and still have 4 feet of track
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

The 2100 sounds interesting indeed.

The only caveat is that I want to keep the overall width at 102" (8 foot 6) so I can legally run the critter down the road or haul it if I want without issue.

Possibly the axle width can be narrowed up to get things to the 102" max.
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Looking at the 2100 frames and they appear to be very little different in structural layout than the Spryte, just a bunch bigger with the far wider stance.

The 3700 now is an entirely different critter.
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Yesterday was a good day.
Craig's List ad paying off.

Got a call from a fella looking for some S10 STUFF and he showed up and we did a deal on the rear axle and the entire Serp drive system off the engine.

Real close now to getting what I want for $0.00

Weather was nice yesterday, so it was pleasant being out wrenching on stuff.

Really amazing thing though was that after getting the serp drive off I was able to get all the exhaust manifold bolts out of the heads with ZERO issues.

With another day or two of good weather in the offing I hope to get the engine and tranny out of the chassis and in out of the weather until I need them.

The gathering process is always fun.

The "IT'S NOT THE DESTINATION, IT'S THE JOURNEY" that counts.
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Sort of in a slow time at the moment.
Have a fellow coming up this morning to get more of the unwanted (by me) S10 stuff.

I ended up with a factory 4 bbl intake from a 4.3 V6 that is not needed and again extra stuff sells readily (For someone else's project) and pays down the costs of my project.

Working steadily on securing a set of tracks for the beast, and have got a solid deal cooking on a set off of a 2100 that are 49" wide.

It is my understanding that these can be narrowed up easily.

Trying to sort out all the data I can before I really get into building the new frame.

I was offered the 2100 tracks at a reasonable $$$$ and they are fairly close. (Driving distance)

I am excited, but have to temper the feelings and make good decisions on things.

Hmmmm
I need more goodies to sell off and get some $$$$ for the project
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Does anyone have a parts/specs manual on the Thiokol 2100??

Looking for as much info as I can get

Thanks troops
 

Snowtrac Nome

member formerly known as dds
GOLD Site Supporter
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Does anyone have a parts/specs manual on the Thiokol 2100??

Looking for as much info as I can get

Thanks troops
as I have the machine I also have the manual package for it. what are you interested in ,give me a number I could snap some pics of the pages that pertain to what you are interested in, and text them to you. safety 0ne has a data sheet posted on their site
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Safety one shows only 57 inch tracks.

I am looking at a pair of 49 inchers

Maybe the are not from a 2100 ??
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Major design changes have been decided upon.

Thinking about all the work ahead and the mods I had been planning and then decided to change directions quite a bit.

Since the van runs so great and all systems function near 100% I decided to keep the engine and tranny in the factory location and mount the entire Safari, guts feathers and all on the new cat chassis.

The only caveat was the AWD transfer case and getting power to the OC12.

The AWD cases require both drive lines to be connected to operate.
Hmmmm.
Decided to swap out the AWD case and bolt in an NP233C case from an S10 which is a manual (Actually electric servo motor) shifted case.

This is a direct bolt in case and will allow power to be directed to the rear only.
The front output will not be needed and can be left unused.

The electric shift motor can be removed (2 bolts) and the case set to 4 high and the selector shaft locked in place with a small bracket the will bolt in place of the motor.

These changes will allow the cat to be assembled far faster than I previously had planned.

Once the "Track chassis" is complete it will be a simple step to roll the Safari on top and bolt it in place.

The only real work will be the drive shaft, and depending on the angle needed may have to have a CV joint in it. (Not gonna sweat the small stuff)

The other issue will be the steering cylinders/levers and hosing that in.

Still looking into a simpler smaller and more compact steering system, but plenty of time.

Last night I located an S10 T case in good shape for $50 and gonna head out in a bit and snag that prize.

So, it looks like the S10 frame gets to stay in one piece for a while longer.

When this new plan hatched my first concern was having the engine and tranny at the stock height due to the higher center of gravity, buttttttttttt, after considering all the bigg Azzzz 4x4 rigs that ya need a ladder to get into running around that don't seem to fall over and play dead readily, it seemed that with a total width of 102" the plan was sound.

Thinking about the Tuckers and some other machines that have their power plants etc fairly high it seems like a great way to get this project up and going easily with far less work and expense.

Very excited about the current direction of things.
 
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

looks like you should go this way----ill be out today with the grandson and a few beers (he watches the in car cam on the drag/no beer) ----been out all winter riding around and grooming my trails a set of mattracks and 500 in a set of 2 plate wheel adapters (my shop builds)and go
 

Attachments

  • food cart--tiny house 028.jpg
    food cart--tiny house 028.jpg
    65.6 KB · Views: 447
  • trail drag--easy pull 005.jpg
    trail drag--easy pull 005.jpg
    43.9 KB · Views: 436
  • new tracker----yellow 009.jpg
    new tracker----yellow 009.jpg
    78.1 KB · Views: 463
  • trail drag--easy pull 004.jpg
    trail drag--easy pull 004.jpg
    58.7 KB · Views: 440

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Mattracks are a sweet deal, but at what cost ????

I looked into a set for my Burb a few years ago and about choked on the $$$$$
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

More good news.

Picked up the NP233 T CASE and it is nice.

Had a fella call up and want some goodies off the S10 chassis and ended up sending a pair of factory mag wheels and some other stuff bye bye.

$$$$ are at a wash at this point.

This is good.

Got several goodies with the T CASE I don't need that will sell quickly and bring more $$$ for the project.

A great day all around.
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Good things finally happening with a set of tracks.

A BIG THANK YOU TO DON UP NOME WAY for measuring the tracks on his 2100 this afternoon for me.

A set of treads I have available are the 57" 2100 tracks and if I cut the outer belts to 3 inches wide and get them cozy right along side the inner belts I can end up with 36 inchers.

Trimming the grousers off and moving the holes in toward the center will finish the revamp.

This is starting to make me feel like we are moving in the right direction anyway.

So this will give me a basically standard (sort of) track that uses components that are not too tough to find.

The 36" track setup is the max I can use and still keep the machine "Street legal" SO WE CAN GO DRAG THE GUT :brows:

Many many hours of research are starting to pay off.

Again, thanks to all for helping with ideas.
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Weather is sloppy but a little bit of work is going on.

A lot of engineering (IMAGINEERING IS A BETTER TERM)

The slight left turn on the design has changed things a bunch as far as parts needed.

The S10 chassis is out of the picture completely as far as parts for the Franken Cat goes, but is coming apart and going down the road piece by piece for good $$$

Just about got the thing stripped now and the initial small $$$$ outlay has risen to within a very few $$$ of paying for the set of tracks I have waiting for me.

Amazing what a few $$$ and some careful wrench time can glean from a pile of junk.


Yesterday saw the exhaust system come off all in one lovely piece.
I never would have bet the head pipe flange nuts/springs would have come loose, but a week soaking with DEEP CREEP and every nut came off easily.

Sold the tranny yesterday too.

Down to just the frame now.

Craig's List is on duty, and the rest should be gone soon.

Planning for this summers agenda.

My shop door is too narrow to get the cat out and we keep hay for the horses in the rear of that building, so no welding/grinding in there.

Decided to pour small slab outside my basement shop area big enough to have a flat/level spot to work on.

Without a cover it will be summer time stuff, but better than working on the dirt.

With a level slab things can proceed quickly.

Sooooooooo...

Gather, gather, gather the parts needed.

Pour the new slab.

If all goes well there will be a set of tracks here in a month or so.
Good possibilities for an OC12 are in the works now.

With some luck I can get the tracks worked over (Going to narrow up a set of 2100 tracks) this summer and then get to work going through the OC12 box and getting it all spiffy.

I am not going to plan too much farther out for this year at present.

More gathering of parts, bits and pieces is likely what will happen as next fall closes in.

Just have to take it one day at a time.

Once all the materials are stock piled this thing can go pretty quick.

Excitement has surfaced its head :brows:
 

undy

New member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

This thread is sounding like an episode of American Pickers. :whistling: Buy some stuff. Sell some stuff. Repeat...

If it was me, I'd hold off on cutting down a good set of tracks until I was absolutely positively certain that, and exactly how, I was going to use them. Once they're cut, they're not worth as much to potential buyers, just in case this project detours again.

I hope this all works out as well as you hope. But with the many hours of research, part/s swapping, prototype mocking, plus the parts to make this thing and extra expenses like that concrete slab, I'm hard-pressed to see that it's going to be cheap - unless you don't count your labor hours. (?)

I'm anxious to see what you come up with, and what you eventually have into the build (as far as hours and $). Best wishes, and thanks for sharing.
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Thanks

As far as the slab goes, its just the cost of a few 2x6's to form it and a load of mud (About 4 yards)

Get a few helpers and a couple hours (Tie up the dogs) :whistling:

The deal with the tracks is pretty straight forward.

I need to have a set of 36 inchers.

Max width on the rig must be NO MORE than 102"

I have a set of 2100 tracks that are 57" and the price is right.

I can easily (Relative term) remove the outer belts, cut them down a bit then move them tight against the inner belts and the reattach the grousers after shortening them.

The 57 inch tracks would be sweet if I lived in a place that had more snow and no worries about hauling the beast or running it on the roads.

With our situation here the rig must be legal width.

American Pickers

Ohhhhh yesss

My parents were into that very thing back in the mid 60's and made a great living at it.

The apple never falls far from the tree ya know :biggrin:

Sadly I can't write a big check for the project and have stuff dropped off.

Gotta buy, sell, swap, etc to gitterdone.

So far the cost are really low.

With the Van coming in at $250 that took care of a huge portion of the build.

Cab, chassis, creature comforts, engine, tranny all ready to go to work.

Of course the cost of the tracks, Diffy, road wheels, suspension parts and the steel for the cat frame will add $$$

Still think this project is gonna be very reasonable
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project (FRANKEN CAT)

When it rains it pours.

Going over details in the drive shaft, emergency drive line brake and u joints.

After getting a plan pretty well figured out I discovered this afternoon that there is a big buzzy fly in the ointment.

The engine/tranny are offset in the little van about 5 inches to the right, ahhhhhhhh, no worries, or so I thought.

The OC12 is on center and this was going to entail building a two piece drive shaft with the rear section using a standard cardan type drive shaft from the diffy to the brake/center support assembly.

Up close to the transfer case I had planned a modified CV axle in there as they can operate in a combined angle with no sweat.

All went well until doofus here discovered that the fuel tank is in the way.

The tank is inside the frame rail and very close to the drive shaft.

The tank gotta go.

At present the plan is to move it behind the rear seat and simply lengthen the fuel lines and run them through the floor.

Not a big deal, but more work.

Having the fuel tank in the stock location would be a real mess if the fuel pump were to die, as the tank would be nearly impossible to remove without taking the van off the cat frame.

Always something.

Makes engineering a fun thing :yum:

The S10 tank is narrower me things and will be easy to fit comfy behind the rear seat.

I did not want to move the tank, but it's the only way.

Having it inside is no big issue other than taking up space.

There is simply no room under the rig.

I have owned many pickups in years past that had the tank behind the seat, so back to basics I guess.

Off to the rodeo :ermm:
 
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

I really don't think I would worry about drive shafts and gas tanks ----get your frame built ---install axles --rear drive and who cares how wide the tracks are ---install them and cut them down later---like the other guy said---start hacking your tracks and they will not be worth much-----you can plan this build all you want but you are going to have a lot of by the ways and o shits---my fab shop builds fiber optic machines for a company with lol hot shot over paid engineers and we always have by the ways----I have 2100 sprockets ill sell
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

The only Caveat with leaving the tracks wide is that everything is based off of a 66 inch center to center on the sprockets and to keep the 102 overall width.

There must be sufficient distance between the tracks to allow the frame risers to come up for the Van body to sit on.

I am trying to measure, calculate and get all the bases covered as close as possible before ever laying a saw on any steel tubing.

When all the numbers come together and stuff continually agrees in the real world with whats on paper then I will buy steel and start stitching it together.

The fuel tank on the van sits right where the drive shaft center support has to go.

The offset drive train complicates things a bit, but at present all things can morph a bit with minimal bother.

With the current plan and measurements a standard 36 inch set of Spryte tracks can be dropped on with no worries.

I am well aware of the OH $HITS and other train wrecks.

That is precisely why I am going over as many details as possible before it costs $$$$$

Once the numbers are all crunched and 1+1 = 2 consitently I will fab up the frame.

Unlike a restoration this cat is going to (Should) go together quickly.

With the body being complete with all equipment and everything working properly the mods to the chassis are very minimal.

Little work really

Plumb in the steering controls and the drive line and things will function.

I really want to avoid spending $$$$ on things and having to do stuff over.

Mistakes on paper are easily rectified, but out in the field it gets a bit dicey.

I used to work in the wood products industry and built and installed huge equipment.

Far too many thing did not work in the real time.

Like you mentioned about the highly overpaid engineers.:whistling:

These guys never had to get their hands dirty fixing the screw ups.

I was in the shop as a Journeyman welder, fabricator, machinist and also spent time in the electrical dept as well as the hydraulics shop too.

This background was helped by the fact that I had an engineering degree as well.

My last position was as a field service engineer/ installer (The make it work crew) :hammer:

Having the engineering background helps some.

Sadly I have to balance things with whats practical and what can be afforded.

Also I believe in using as much off the shelf stuff as possible to keep cost down.

Your 2100 sprockets ???

What tooth count ???

If memory serves the 1200 and 2100 use similar sprockets ????

I know the pitch is the same.

I just want to avoid (if possible) having to redo stuff or stumbling onto issues late in the game.

Having as many standard parts as possible is top priority.

If I need a replacement part, I want to be able to hit the Napa or Autozone and walk out with it.

There of course will be things that will not be as such, but minimum as much as possible.

I guess my reluctance to start beating on the iron so soon is the result of having to cut so much stuff apart in the field over the years.

Since the mistakes are coming from my pocket, ahhhhh, noooooooo.

Once the steel starts laying down I want to feel comfy with the design.

In reality I can't use the 2100 tracks as they are, simply too wide.

102" is the magic number.
 
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

ok I really don't think you get it-----what is the center to center on the rear end your using-----the tracks on the inside will all b the same the outside changes----the tracks could b 10 feet wide---the inside/center to center does not change----a packmaster is a packmaster-----and the budget thing----lol
 

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

Some tracks are asymmetrical, happily the ones I have are standard 57 inch symmetrical ones.

The diffy is a standard Spryte and the specs call out 61 inches center to center distance

(Spec sheet says wheel track width)

This dimension seems to vary from spec sheet to spec sheet.
Some have called out 65 inches for a standard width.

Another sheet called out 99-1/2 inch overall width with 36" tracks, and this would calculate to a center to center of 63-1/2" centers..????????????????????????


Tooooooooo many variables that I can't just overlook and start tossing steel together.

Setting up the 57 inch tracks as they are on the basis that a standard 3 foot track must end up at 102" would require a center to center distance of 66"

OK

Lets set the axle up with 66 inch centers and then stick on the 57 inch tracks.

1/2 of 57 inches is 28-1/2 inches

With 28-1/2 inches inward on both side from the center of the sprockets will be 57"

With this set up the inner edges of the tracks will only be 9 inches apart ?????

Using the 36 inch width will place the inner edge of the tracks at 30 inches apart.

This allows enough room to fabricate frame risers to extend above the top of the track to mount the body to.

As budget goes.

As little as is possible is the key here.

I will spend $$$ where I have to, but this project is running on a tight purse.

I simply do not have the luxury of a fat wallet.

I do understand .

What I don't quite have a handle on is the worry about cutting the tracks down to do what I need.

Cut now or cut later and the results will be the same.

The plan is to start building like building a house, foundation (Tracks) and then the framing, then up from there.

I really do appreciate the concerns, but rest assured, nothing is gonna get chopped until the tape measure has been laid on things and the calculations are all agreeing.
 
Last edited:

Snowy Rivers

Well-known member
Re: An introduction/hello and my project.

I might as well take the time to explain "Budget"

Mine is minimal as I am retired and have tight limits on "Disposable funds"

Sooooooooo.

I will spend, lets take the S10 frame for example, $300 for the entire frame and running gear.

I took off 1 component I wanted and then started selling off the unwanted items.

Just about done parting it out now and the $300 investment has turned into $1200 return.

One piece at a time, ka ching $$$$

The actual cash outlay for things will be heavily surpassed by the return on unwanted goodies.

I bought the 233C transfer case from a 96 S10 with adapter and front drive shaft for $50 and then sold the adapter for $50 and the front shaft for $50

Sold the electric shift motor for $25 (Don't need it)

This is the way I do projects.

Two years ago my son in law wanted to build up a 53 GMC Deuce and a half 6x6

We scared up the first of 3 trucks for $400
Then a second truck with a fire tank and pump for $1000
Third came a complete truck (Drivable for $1500)

Started planning and gathering more parts.

He wanted diesel power, so we found a diesel engine.

Next came the tranny.
Scared up a 4 speed Allison for $200

Allison too big, sold it to a fella for his Nodwell for $400.

Bought a Turbo 400... Kid wanted an OD tranny.

Sold the 400 and tripled the $$$$$ (From $100 to $300)

Sold off the Army truck (6x6 extras)
Fire tank $500
Front bumper $100
Spare tire carrier $100
Engine $800
Tranny $400
And so on

Anyway
My $$$ outlay is back in my hands and the kid has his pile of Army truck goodies to fool with.

This is how my budget works.

A real left handed way to get things done, but it makes it possible.

Thank Gawd for Craig's List.

Best thing since sliced bread.

So, the project continues.
 
Last edited:
Top