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Terra 543

1boringguy

Well-known member
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If you don't get fb, it looks like this;
 

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Pontoon Princess

Cattitute
GOLD Site Supporter
asking price is $75,000.00

have no idea why tucker sno cat inc would be so coy about the price, the minute someone calls and gets the details and price will be out there, never have seen the wisdom of playing that game, either you are proud of your work or have something to hide

IMHO, nothing beats a 500 series machine.

as restoration cost goes, not out of line.

buy it without the rubber tracks and convert it back....
 
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Blackfoot Tucker

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
A few years ago I was told a mining company in Utah converted their rubber-belted Tucker to Terra tracks and the cost was about $60K. If that's true, that $75K all-in price may not be out of line.

I'm wondering if the condition of the axles and steel track system on this 543 was so poor that it was easier/cheaper to go with a Terra track system rather than restore/replace the original equipment. Don't know, just speculating.

Seventy five thousand dollars is a lot of money for a 50 year old used snowcat!
 

DAVENET

Bronze Member
GOLD Site Supporter
Personally, with the work done on it and changes, I would term it as a brand new retro look Sno-Cat.
 

Pontoon Princess

Cattitute
GOLD Site Supporter
BT, sir

having passed on this cat after seeing it before tucker sno cat bought, to say the least, it was rough, ( fyi, tucker paid up for the privilege ) and the pontoons were even worst, thus, the pontoons and tracks were only good for parts at best, as for the axles, international 1 ton truck, hard to tear them up, they are very durable...

and just how much do you have in your thundercat? LOL, the money adds up quickly if you keep track of it, best never to know.....

not to question your wisdom or good judgement, IMHO, if this machine still had it's original 500 pontoons, it would be well worth the money, if everything was done correctly....

it is either a cocaine habit or a snow cat

tucker is just a pontoon on the snow you throw money into..
 

GMoose

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
A few years ago I was told a mining company in Utah converted their rubber-belted Tucker to Terra tracks and the cost was about $60K. If that's true, that $75K all-in price may not be out of line.

I'm wondering if the condition of the axles and steel track system on this 543 was so poor that it was easier/cheaper to go with a Terra track system rather than restore/replace the original equipment. Don't know, just speculating.

Seventy five thousand dollars is a lot of money for a 50 year old used snowcat!

You are correct, the pontoons/tracks are in very poor condition, I now own them. When I talked to Clyde, he indicated that since they were in such poor condition is why they went with the Terra tracks.
 

redsqwrl

Bronze Member
GOLD Site Supporter
pontoon on the snow......

with cocaine habit used in the same stanza.......

sorry, my 13 year old mind sometimes spills out.....

The 175" tracks are not very common, 200" are more prevalent.

the tucker specific parts drive the value on the build presented here. If you call camso (or who ever) you can not get those tracks. the driver for the tracks is also a tucker specific part.
I do mobile service work as a side hustle. this price is not unrealistic for most of my customers. this would not sell to them, due to the cab size. for that kind of money you could get two 50 hour machines with wider extended cabs and a sweet diesel engine.
 

Blackfoot Tucker

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
BT, sir

having passed on this cat after seeing it before tucker sno cat bought, to say the least, it was rough, ( fyi, tucker paid up for the privilege ) and the pontoons were even worst, thus, the pontoons and tracks were only good for parts at best, as for the axles, international 1 ton truck, hard to tear them up, they are very durable...

and just how much do you have in your thundercat? LOL, the money adds up quickly if you keep track of it, best never to know.....

not to question your wisdom or good judgement, IMHO, if this machine still had it's original 500 pontoons, it would be well worth the money, if everything was done correctly....


it is either a cocaine habit or a snow cat

tucker is just a pontoon on the snow you throw money into..

PP,

Thanks for the "rest of the story", as Paul Harvey used to say.

I honestly don't know how much I have spent on Thundercat, and you called it exactly with the phrase "best never to know". I can say the machine was bought "right", which then gives one a lot of room for putting money into it, and still at least breaking even. But that doesn't include labor and Scott and I have put a whole bunch of that into Thundercat. It's a pretty unique machine and we're kicking around some additional mods... (Why not...you can't take it with you?)

We enjoy working together and the snowcat projects are an opportunity to do that. Thundercat was/is a somewhat unique project as more of an exercise in what we could do, without (too much) regard for cost.

Your phrase "if everything was done correctly" is, in my opinion, totally on point. I'm in the (hopefully latter) stages of having a sixties muscle car professionally restored. The fellow doing the work routinely wins top trophies at national shows and his attention to detail is simply incredible. Nothing gets overlooked...nothing.

I've seen some truly lousy workmanship from the Tucker factory. If they couldn't be bothered to do it right the first time, why should I assume they would now? Trust is earned... Tucker has yet to earn mine.
 

Pontoon Princess

Cattitute
GOLD Site Supporter
pontoon on the snow......

with cocaine habit used in the same stanza.......

sorry, my 13 year old mind sometimes spills out.....

The 175" tracks are not very common, 200" are more prevalent.

the tucker specific parts drive the value on the build presented here. If you call camso (or who ever) you can not get those tracks. the driver for the tracks is also a tucker specific part.
I do mobile service work as a side hustle. this price is not unrealistic for most of my customers. this would not sell to them, due to the cab size. for that kind of money you could get two 50 hour machines with wider extended cabs and a sweet diesel engine.

ah ha. one off track size, bet these tracks were left from the 542 project of a couple years ago, fyi, when tucker sold the 542 with the rubber belt track, they removed the rubber track set up and sold it with original pontoons on it, IMHO, this machine would be much better off with pontoons...
 

1boringguy

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
Ok anyone please free to school me on terra tracks. My understanding is that the 155 tracks were discontinued because basically almost no one ordered them. The 175 are pretty commonly used on the 2000xl as well as the 2000. The 200 tracks are an option? The 175 have basically been a good track while the 200 have had issues. Internal design differences being the key factor between the 175 and the 200 tracks.
 

redsqwrl

Bronze Member
GOLD Site Supporter
I should preface my post with here in the midwest.

I am near the monico *track inc* the original i might add. Get-snow out east is the other, newer track-inc, east..... ( this is a joke for a handfull here )

I think the monico dealer has a Blue 2000xl used on the web for sale with 175" tracks when you walk on the lot they are mostly long tracks. I have been to many groomer barns around the midwest and upper midwest and its a 200" world.

I am not sure it is a fair statement to the internal design differences. I have cut both open to repair and repurpose these tracks, they are all built similar with fiber glass rods and multiply belting under a heavy rubber cover. various groomer mechanics (like motor oil) all have an opinion about what is right and or wrong with the design. and whether to run the tight or loose..... One thing is in common. all of them get tore up. the reasons vary.
the last thing the operator ever reports to the mechanic is the truth. some clubs lock out high gear in the groomers to keep the heat out of the tracks.

Just looking at how the 543 carrier is built, there is a good wrap on the drive sprockets. ( around heere they call that a high top) It is doubtful the design is intended to pull at a sustained time period a 28" drag full of snow.
the 543 in the discussion is a near perfect combination of sexy and function for a cabin owner who whats a unique form of transportation in their life.
  • blast through the snow way better than any pick up truck on snowmobile tracks
  • work if it has too.
  • be able to run up a plowed road surface with out shaking the mirrors off the doors.
  • and look the part doing it.

My only negative comment would be the size of the cab. either people were small back then on avg. or there was efficiency of scale like a peterbuilt cab design, for the manufacturing process. ( the entire cab of an old peterbuilt can be laid out of 4x8 sheets of material with no waste.
snow cats need to light. maybe the size was the critical element. PSI per square inch of track is where the ability to float over the snow instead of thru the snow would be.
You know like the snow trac and track master......:th_lmao:
 

1boringguy

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
Redsqwrl,

Thanks for the input, your check for $.02 is in the mail ?

It makes sense that the 200 tracks are preferred for 'work' machines while perhaps not really a big deal for recreational use, especially on a lighter machine like the 2000xl. As far as issues, it is easy to imagine that many more instances of track issues 'show up' in the 'work' machines just because of the severity of duty and sheer number of hours of use, by comparison. Like how many differential issues show up in show trucks that simply bobtail from one show to another, vs lowboy trucks dragging 200,000 lbs over mountain passes?
 

Pontoon Princess

Cattitute
GOLD Site Supporter
from the ad, hard to tell what has been done, could be a quickie repaint, tune up with change out of tracks or a full blown rebuild, done right...

think it would serve tucker co well, to write a far more detailed ad with photos showing what was done and a price, pretty sure, a person that is looking for a machine will know instantly that is the one for them, without a bunch of games...
 

Blackfoot Tucker

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
from the ad, hard to tell what has been done, could be a quickie repaint, tune up with change out of tracks or a full blown rebuild, done right...

think it would serve tucker co well, to write a far more detailed ad with photos showing what was done and a price, pretty sure, a person that is looking for a machine will know instantly that is the one for them, without a bunch of games...

PP,

The current Tucker newsletter (October, 2019) has some more photos on page 5, but no more details. Here's a link:http://tuckersnocat.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/volume-11issue-10.pdf

If Tucker went to the time, trouble and expense to truly overhaul/restore the machine to include a professionally rebuilt engine, new clutch assembly with re-surfaced flywheel as well as disassembling, inspecting and reassembling the transmission, and transfer case, not to mention all new universal joints in the driveshafts, new hoses throughout, etc, etc, I would think they would say so. That's a lot of work and expense and helps in justifying the price.

That implies (by omission) they did none of the above. I'm assuming the 318 is original to the machine and therefore dates to 1970. Back then there was no such thing as unleaded gasoline and cylinder heads did not have hardened exhaust valve seats or improved exhaust valve materials. If the cylinder heads have not been reworked, I would anticipate that may be required. Even having someone else do the work it's still only $1K or so, but that would have been addressed in a proper restoration.

Looking at the photos, I'm wondering if what I'll call the the "side shields" (below the hood on each side) are missing - or perhaps they were not so equipped back then? The new exhaust pipe protruding from where I would expect to see the side shields seems odd...

It's hard to tell with certainty from the photos, but looking at the paint it does not appear to be a nice smooth, glossy finish, but rather somewhat flat in appearance. It may be the lighting is causing that look, I honestly don't know....

Lastly, a question for you. You mentioned having seen this machine first hand and passing on it. I recall a yellow 543 of roughly this vintage for sale on craigslist (in Washington State, I believe) for quite a while and priced at $15K. Is this that Tucker?
 

Pontoon Princess

Cattitute
GOLD Site Supporter
PP,

The current Tucker newsletter (October, 2019) has some more photos on page 5, but no more details. Here's a link:http://tuckersnocat.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/volume-11issue-10.pdf

If Tucker went to the time, trouble and expense to truly overhaul/restore the machine to include a professionally rebuilt engine, new clutch assembly with re-surfaced flywheel as well as disassembling, inspecting and reassembling the transmission, and transfer case, not to mention all new universal joints in the driveshafts, new hoses throughout, etc, etc, I would think they would say so. That's a lot of work and expense and helps in justifying the price.

That implies (by omission) they did none of the above. I'm assuming the 318 is original to the machine and therefore dates to 1970. Back then there was no such thing as unleaded gasoline and cylinder heads did not have hardened exhaust valve seats or improved exhaust valve materials. If the cylinder heads have not been reworked, I would anticipate that may be required. Even having someone else do the work it's still only $1K or so, but that would have been addressed in a proper restoration.

Looking at the photos, I'm wondering if what I'll call the the "side shields" (below the hood on each side) are missing - or perhaps they were not so equipped back then? The new exhaust pipe protruding from where I would expect to see the side shields seems odd...

It's hard to tell with certainty from the photos, but looking at the paint it does not appear to be a nice smooth, glossy finish, but rather somewhat flat in appearance. It may be the lighting is causing that look, I honestly don't know....

Lastly, a question for you. You mentioned having seen this machine first hand and passing on it. I recall a yellow 543 of roughly this vintage for sale on craigslist (in Washington State, I believe) for quite a while and priced at $15K. Is this that Tucker?


starting with you last question first, no this is not the Washington machine, which sold for $8K and has almost new rollers.

the one that tucker bought and worked on, was well worn and badly rusted, it was out of central idaho, and it was a real rust bucket, it really need to have the inside of the tubing treated, like airplane frames to prevent rust, and tucker paid up to own it and it was rough rough rough, I personally looked at it many years ago and passed on it and at that time, the price was $1,000.00, it was not worth my time to haul it home.

the paint is flat orange, no shine

yes the side panels are not there, though the front ones in the engine compartment were expanded metal

the engine is original to the 543, and if they did do a complete rebuild, I sure would have fitted it with fuel injection, so easy and reasonably priced upgrade.

factory exhaust did run down the side of lower body and came out right above the middle of the rear pontoon, the way tucker inc ran it, it will for sure cause the exhaust fumes to come into the rear compartment of the body, gas mask required.

the rubber tracks really do take value away, as the 500 pontoons are far superior IMHO

yup, tucker inc, does themselves no favors when they play COY GAMES with info and price, thus you need to call Clyde, lucky you...they think they are selling a $35,000.000.00 Ferrari.
 

PJL

Well-known member
Cocaine vs Snowcat.



After a heavy night of partying you still have a snowcat. Cocaine is all gone...
 

Blackfoot Tucker

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
starting with you last question first, no this is not the Washington machine, which sold for $8K and has almost new rollers.

the one that tucker bought and worked on, was a well worn and badly rusted, it was out of central idaho, and it was a real rust bucket, it really need to have the inside of the tubing treated, like airplane frames to prevent rust, and tucker paid up to own it and it was rough rough rough, I personally looked at it many years ago and passed on it and at that time, the price was $1,000.00, it was not worth my time to haul it home.

the paint is flat orange, no shine

yes the side panels are not there, though the front ones in the engine compartment were expanded metal

the engine is original to the 543, and if they did do a complete rebuild, I sure would have fitted it with fuel injection, so easy and reasonably priced upgrade.

factory exhaust did run down the side of lower body and came out right above the middle of the rear pontoon, the way tucker inc ran it, it will for sure cause the exhaust fumes to come into the rear compartment of the body, gas mask required.

the rubber tracks really do take value away, as the 500 pontoons are far superior IMHO

yup, tucker inc, does themselves no favors when they play COY GAMES with info and price, thus you need to call Clyde, lucky you...they think they are selling a $35,000.000.00 Ferrari.


PP,

Thanks for all the details. It seems the closer we look, the worse it gets...which isn't a good thing!

Your encyclopedic knowledge is very, very impressive to me. If you said you knew the whereabouts of every 543 Tucker ever made... I wouldn't doubt it!

While buying a machine that's been fully restored has some appeal, you're taking a great deal on faith. And a low quality restoration is, in my opinion, worse than none at all.

Tucker should have the blueprints/drawings for the side shields. I can certainly understand them missing from the machine when they acquired it, but having all the necessary specifications to make new ones, and not doing it (despite a $75K price) calls into question what else they didn't do...

I do not have a "warm fuzzy" about this machine...
 

Pontoon Princess

Cattitute
GOLD Site Supporter
PP,

Thanks for all the details. It seems the closer we look, the worse it gets...which isn't a good thing!

Your encyclopedic knowledge is very, very impressive to me. If you said you knew the whereabouts of every 543 Tucker ever made... I wouldn't doubt it!

While buying a machine that's been fully restored has some appeal, you're taking a great deal on faith. And a low quality restoration is, in my opinion, worse than none at all.

Tucker should have the blueprints/drawings for the side shields. I can certainly understand them missing from the machine when they acquired it, but having all the necessary specifications to make new ones, and not doing it (despite a $75K price) calls into question what else they didn't do...

I do not have a "warm fuzzy" about this machine...

my greatest concern when buying a "restored" machine, tucker used square tubing through the frame ( very low grade steel, cost saving measure as the selling price continued to climb, year after year) and it is a well know fact, that, the tubing, rusts from the inside out, I want to know if the restorer treated/abated the rust issues, such as using Lind seed oil in the frame, just little they do with with older airplane frames

I much prefer a unrestored machine, hard to hide what is not done.

and this is why I continue to strongly believe for the money, a snow trac is a great value for the snow cat dollar, grouser for grouser, I love my snow trac
 
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MNoutdoors RIP

Gone But Not Forgotten
GOLD Site Supporter
I much prefer a unrestored machine.


The best kind :smile:
 

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luvthemvws

Active member
and this is why I continue to strongly believe for the money, a snow trac is a great value for the snow cat dollar, grouser for grouser, I love my snow trac[/QUOTE]

And this from a person that has a good share of vintage Tuckers!
She's right of course. A Snow Trac is nearly ideal for the part time/recreational snow catter.
They are compact, light, easily transported or stored, and most parts are common (vw drivetrain) or reasonably available.
A Tucker like this certainly has appeal to a certain (narrow) segment of the snow cat enthusiasts, just not many of us.
I hope they find a buyer.
I would love to see it out in the snow at a get together!
 

olympicorange

Active member
PP,

Thanks for the "rest of the story", as Paul Harvey used to say.

I honestly don't know how much I have spent on Thundercat, and you called it exactly with the phrase "best never to know". I can say the machine was bought "right", which then gives one a lot of room for putting money into it, and still at least breaking even. But that doesn't include labor and Scott and I have put a whole bunch of that into Thundercat. It's a pretty unique machine and we're kicking around some additional mods... (Why not...you can't take it with you?)

We enjoy working together and the snowcat projects are an opportunity to do that. Thundercat was/is a somewhat unique project as more of an exercise in what we could do, without (too much) regard for cost.

Your phrase "if everything was done correctly" is, in my opinion, totally on point. I'm in the (hopefully latter) stages of having a sixties muscle car professionally restored. The fellow doing the work routinely wins top trophies at national shows and his attention to detail is simply incredible. Nothing gets overlooked...nothing.

I've seen some truly lousy workmanship from the Tucker factory. If they couldn't be bothered to do it right the first time, why should I assume they would now? Trust is earned... Tucker has yet to earn mine.

….. considering where youre located.... would ..''KINDIGIT '' be the correct guess ...of your muscle car project.... :thumbup::thumbup:
 

Blackfoot Tucker

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
….. considering where youre located.... would ..''KINDIGIT '' be the correct guess ...of your muscle car project.... :thumbup::thumbup:

That's a very good guess, but the answer is no. The fellow who is doing my car is best known for Pontiacs, though that's not what he's doing for me. He's not local to SLC, or even Utah... I found him through a very good friend who had a 1965 GTO convertible restored by him. Incredibly beautiful car!

He's been restoring cars for a long time and I'm amazed how he is able to maintain his incredible attention to detail through project after project.
 

Pontoon Princess

Cattitute
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soooooo, what are you having restored?????

and really, you let get away with saying, snow trac is the best value for the snow cat dollar, you are slipping...
 

Blackfoot Tucker

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
soooooo, what are you having restored?????

and really, you let get away with saying, snow trac is the best value for the snow cat dollar, you are slipping...

Restoration project is a secret until it's done...

Rest assured, I noticed the Snow Trac comment. I didn't want to take anything away from this thread, so I let it pass.

I also noticed the Snow Trac invitation on the Serenade thread, and it took great personal restraint not to throw out a jab of some kind.
 

Pontoon Princess

Cattitute
GOLD Site Supporter
Restoration project is a secret until it's done...

Rest assured, I noticed the Snow Trac comment. I didn't want to take anything away from this thread, so I let it pass.

I also noticed the Snow Trac invitation on the Serenade thread, and it took great personal restraint not to throw out a jab of some kind.


pretty sure it is a chevy...

oh, you will get your chance, when the snow tracs get stuck up to their turn signals, and the tuckers will stay orange and continue the climb into the high country.....
 
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