I am in the process of swapping out the 223 motor in my 62 trackmaster to a 300 ford and was woundering where I could find an oc15 steering differential so I could get away with the twin drive shafts and power divider thats in it right now and go to a 601 style drive line or something newer that I could fit in this machine.I am also wanting to put an auto trans in place of the 3 speed standard.Does anybody know of any thiokol dealers in Canada where I could find the stuff to do a conversion like this?
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4t10 trackmaster to 601 conversion
- Thread starter darryl
- Start date
If you go with the OC-12 I would use a AOD automatic transmission behind the 300 Ford. The 300 was a very popular engine in many Ford trucks in the 80s. You should be able to find a complete unit at most junk yards. If not you can Google Ford 300 cid and should be able to locate newly rebuilt units for about $1400 U.S.. BUT you will need all the accesories so you would be better off getting a "Running" used Ford truck that has an automatic in it already. These will most likey have a C-4 Auto in them already. You can keep that auto or swap in a AOD auto. The AOD has a .67 Overdrive That is really handy on some of those drop axled OC-12s. The "Running" truck is your best bet. You can drive it around and tune it up until you have EVERYTHING at hand to do the swap. Thats probably the best way to do a swap of any kind. We have some really good dealers who are members here on the Forums. Seek them out as well. I am sure most of them have an OC-12 for sale. Also keep in mind that there were alot more Ford 250 cid inline 6s made than 300s. The 250s have the V8 bell housing bolt pattern which will allow any Ford tranmission used in a Ford V8 to be bolted right up to a 250. If you go that route the only thing you will need is a Flexplate out of a 300 to bolt an automatic up. I hope this helps!
I'm thinking it's gonna be alot more work to upgrade the drive than it's worth. An OC-15 is not gonna just slip right in there behind an automatic without alot of other major modifications.
DARRYL Drop WEATHERBY a line. I am sure he would buy your 233. At least ask him.
How wide is the frame on the4T10? I believe the width on my OC12 equiped Thiokol is 21-1/4"from side to side. Thats off the top of my head. I need to measure it to make sure. But for now its close enough to give you an idea. The steering or braking levers should be pretty easy to fab. Thats pretty much it. Everything else is pretty straight forward. Drive line, OC12 mounting. Brake lines ect ect.
Measuring the drive sprockets center to center width is a good place to start. Unless that's close to being the same I'd call it a deal killer. Keep in mind you will probably have to use the 4T10 sprockets (601 and 1200 Sprite are different) unless you plan to change tracks. Fabricating automatic transmission mounts (and cooler) probably won't be too hard. Don't forget about the diveline brake when you're having the driveshaft built. Don't get me wrong, it would be a neat project and I'm sure it could be done.. Just consider the time and money involved verses the cost of buying what your trying to build.
Since we keep kicking this one around I really hope Darryl does this modification and shares his experience with the rest of us. On that note, has anybody done, seen, or even heard of a successful transplant of an OC-15 or OC-12 into a 4T10?
This doesn't specifically answer your question... but you guys have seen the snow toaster 4T10 conversion to a Bombi diff right?
I haven't seen a conversion to an OC12 or OC15. That 4T10 that Mark sold on eBay for $25K was still with the dual shafts...so I find that kind of interesting... $25K w/o a switch to a 'modern' diff.
I'm curious that if there are so many disfunctional twin-shaft Trackmasters out there... what did they do? If they didn't convert then did they fix and whatever they did there should be some good information on fixing the twin-shaft design or info on conversion to a 'modern' diff...has to be one or the other... unless they bagged it and sold them. But then someone else (isn't EVERYONE who's anyone on this forum???? if not then they should be!). 8)
If they are just sitting out there...someone point me to them! 8)
The Snow Toaster is a fine example of what time, money, and skill can do. Is that a Bombardiar Muskeg drive he swapped in? Mainer, what are the major problems and what parts are hard to find with these 4VL type drives? There has to be alot of these Trackmasters out there and it seems like rebuilding would be the way to go especially for a transport cat.
I'm not sure if it's a Muskeg or not... Boggie... you know?
The main things that go wrong with the twin shaft design (from what I've gathered through discussions with various owners that have been in and out and upside down through power divider rebuilds, etc.):
1. Incorrect reassembly...the angles and shaft-balance in properly assembling these puppies is critical. Supposedly it's the part of the rebuild that is the art/experience. This is the main reason that (as Snow Ops said he's known of owners that have broken systems), they break.
2. Bearings within the power divider...not easy to find original but can be replaced with new parts (while maintaing originality, of course!)
3. Clutch disks in the power divider (not all *that* hard to find remakes ... which work great...but the best is the old-school and finding new-old stock is very, very hard...but that doesn't matter that much... I believe it has good ol' "asbestos inside" ).
4. Axles would go if too much load was placed on such as a drag...but replacement isn't bad at all... mine went in the 4T2 with 2,800 lbs. It was fine at 2,000 lbs.
5. The tube between the drop boxes would break so it was upgraded to a thicker wall tube spec. Nothing big.
In the end, it's not that bad although I do believe it's tricky if a person is just going in blind and it's all in pieces... and some components of the system are broken right up front...non-standard comonents that is.
Is that a Bombardiar Muskeg drive he swapped in? Mainer,
What unit are we talking here ? to look at as far as the drive? pictures?
What unit are we talking here ? to look at as far as the drive? pictures?
Is that a Bombardiar Muskeg drive he swapped in? Mainer,
What unit are we talking here ? to look at as far as the drive? pictures?
Boggie-
I'm thinking of the Toaster... It was a 78 Bombi diff but not sure which one...maybe you can tell from the photos. It wasn't a straight swap-in as it was too wide but still worked just fine. I haven't done a comparison of dimensions between OC15 and OC12 but I believe the 15 casing is larger so the 12 may fit nicely in. Not sure. He may have gone Bombi due to availability... not sure.
Can you tell what it is based on your visual mental snowcat encyclopedia britannica???
Attachments
A few more pictures would help but from what I can see it was a front drive Bombardier and since it is to narrow for a SW48 it either looks like a J5 or a Muskeg but it has neither of the axle tubes from either one the tubes look like they are off a SKi Dozer 250 or 300 
bkvail
New member
Hello, that is my husband's trackmaster that he fabricated in the Bombardier diff. The diff was from a model 250 he was told. He got it from a rolled cat - got it for $1000 and then had to put $1300 worth of ring/pinion gears into it. It was not an easy swap by any means either. We don't have a lot of money, so these things were definitely ''saved up for''.
And, yes, he went with that diff. because of availability. And, his brother was buying a cat from the same place that he got the diff (in Idaho I think?), so it was done in one trip.
Karin
And, yes, he went with that diff. because of availability. And, his brother was buying a cat from the same place that he got the diff (in Idaho I think?), so it was done in one trip.
Karin
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If you ever do need a Ring and pinion get in touch with me we have them for about half of that price. That is the retail price right now we have them made 200 at a time and sell to the dealers and also have sold to Bombardier ( Camoplast)
bkvail
New member
If you ever do need a Ring and pinion get in touch with me we have them for about half of that price. That is the retail price right now we have them made 200 at a time and sell to the dealers and also have sold to Bombardier ( Camoplast)
I certainly hope we don't have to ever put another ring/pinion into it! I can't imagine putting that many miles on it, but I will definitely keep it in mind
The OC-15 is much wider than an OC-12. I think an OC-12 swap would be rathe straight forward for any of the 601s or 4Ts. Boggie has a bunch in stock if memory serves me correct.
I certainly hope we don't have to ever put another ring/pinion into it! I can't imagine putting that many miles on it, but I will definitely keep it in mind
Couple of pointers do not let the tracks freeze to the ground ( park on a logs or 4 by 4's that run the full length of the tracks under the wheels ) that is the quickest way to destroy a pinion another is that differential. in use when it warms up and then you quit for the day it will pull moisture from the air and condense inside the differential case if you do this enough you will have enough water in the bottom of the case to freezze the ring gear in place and the same thing can happen. we have repaired dozens of ring and pinions becase of this. drain your fluid or at least some of it once per winter after it has sat over night to remove the acccumulated water . ( this only works if you have a heated area.) otherwise it will be frozen
bkvail
New member
Couple of pointers do not let the tracks freeze to the ground ( park on a logs or 4 by 4's that run the full length of the tracks under the wheels ) that is the quickest way to destroy a pinion another is that differential. in use when it warms up and then you quit for the day it will pull moisture from the air and condense inside the differential case if you do this enough you will have enough water in the bottom of the case to freezze the ring gear in place and the same thing can happen. we have repaired dozens of ring and pinions becase of this. drain your fluid or at least some of it once per winter after it has sat over night to remove the acccumulated water . ( this only works if you have a heated area.) otherwise it will be frozen
thank you - I will let hubby know of the condensation problem. It rarely freezes really hard here (NW WA), but it does a couple times a year. He's got really expensive fluid in there thinking that way he could make it last the longest. I'm trying to think of why he had to replace the ring/pinion - I think the shaft of the pinion was broken if I remember correctly! Hmm - now, I thought the cat was rolled that he got it from, but maybe they just parted it out because of the broken pinion...... He's had that together for about 4 years now - and so far no problems. (knock on wood)
Karin
Make sure to tell him to change that fluid once a year minimum if only used occasionally.
bkvail
New member
why would it need to be changed so often if he drained it? He use a really expensive synthetic oil, that would suck to have to replace that every year, ack. He also parks it on wood planks so it's never sitting in the dirt/grass (to hopefully extend the life of the tracks mostly!)
weatherby
Member
Here"s a method that we use when we want to get any water out of EXPENSIVE lubricant that still has many many hours left in it. We drain the lubricant out of the machine after it is warm or (at least above freezing) then take the oil and let it sit in BELOW FREEZING temps. or a chest type freezer or what ever is ever more convenient, let it sit for a day or so to let the water (if there is any) FREEZE in the bottom of the container. Then pore the oil back out and you will have a chunk of FROZEN water left behind separated from the oil.
Looks like a 4T4 to 4T10 to 1200 Thiokol to me. With the reduction OC-12 and 12" wheels it looks like someone set the Trackmaster body on a 1200C chassis.
tomelroy
Member
after i bought it i wonder the same thing, but some of the original chassis is still there...old suspension removed....torsion axles added....smaller 12" tires and rims, and the oc-12...it also has a 4 speed instead of the 3 speed. I may one day change that to an automatic. I am sure a 1200c was the donor.
But i do like the idea of a Trackmaster body on a 1200c chassis... and it probably would be easier.
But i do like the idea of a Trackmaster body on a 1200c chassis... and it probably would be easier.