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Disease Prevention Often Costs MORE than the Cure?

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
Interesting news article today. I know from my experience as an employer we had 'wellness' programs that cost a bundle and had no measurable results. So from that point of view this article actually reinforces what I suspected, but could not quantify.

Disease prevention often costs more than it saves

By CARLA K. JOHNSON, AP Medical Writer
Wed Jun 24, 3:16 pm ET
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090624...zBHBvcwMxNARzZWMDdG9vbHMtdG9wBHNsawNwcmludA--

CHICAGO – When it comes to health care spending, an ounce of prevention is seldom worth a pound of cure. Take Mrs. Jones, a hypothetical 55-year-old obese woman at risk for diabetes. It costs $900 a year to hire a personal lifestyle coach to help her lose weight and prevent diabetes. Suppose that the coaching works for Mrs. Jones, and she is spared diabetes and all the resulting health bills.

But research shows that for every person like Mrs. Jones, six other people just like her get nothing out of such a program. They either don't lose weight or get diabetes anyway or wouldn't have developed it in the first place. The yearly cost of the prevention program for those six people: $5,400.

That's probably more than Mrs. Jones' health bills from diabetes would have amounted to.

There goes your pound of cure.

The truth is, shockingly few prevention efforts actually save the health care system money overall, despite claims by the president and some in Congress.

Discussing daily aspirin use with people at risk of heart disease does save money. So do vaccinations for children. When doctors talk to smokers and offer medication to help them quit, that, too, saves money.

But those are the exceptions.

Prevention is a good deal, some experts say, if you can buy one year of perfect health for less than $50,000. The most-recommended prevention efforts — like flu shots for adults, Pap smears for women and colon cancer screening for people over 50 — meet that cutoff. But they certainly don't save money.

Some say cost is beside the point, since those things save lives at what's deemed a reasonable expense.

Back to Mrs. Jones. Helping 100 people like her would cost $270,000 over three years, but also would prevent 15 new cases of diabetes, avoid the need for blood pressure or cholesterol-lowering pills in 11 people, avoid $65,500 in medical spending for all 100 people and prevent 162 missed days of work due to sickness.

Dr. Ronald Ackermann at Indiana University School of Medicine in Indianapolis said recent studies suggest that offering the diabetes prevention program to groups of 10 people — instead of one-on-one coaching — can lead to similar benefits and cost as little as $15 per month.

The YMCA is offering just such a group program. Retired accountant Paul Mullen, 66, of Indianapolis, has lost 18 pounds since May and brought his blood sugar down because of lifestyle changes he learned. He pays $115 for the yearlong program, on top of his Y membership fee. He feels better, his knees don't hurt as much and he can't wait to see his doctor's reaction when he gets his next checkup.

"I should have done it years ago," he said. "My daughter-in-law got after me. The wife did, too. So far, it's worked."

Michael Maciosek of HealthPartners Research Foundation in Minneapolis found that of 25 highly recommended prevention strategies, 15 cost less than $35,000 for every year of perfect health gained.

Those are definitely bargains if you're using the arbitrary cutoff of $50,000 per healthy year to decide what's a good investment in health spending. And some economists say Americans would be willing to spend even more than that, say $100,000 per perfect health year.

No one really knows how much of the U.S. health care dollar goes toward prevention. The most commonly cited number — 3 cents of every health care dollar — is based on 20-year-old data. An updated number — nearly 9 cents of every health care dollar — represents about $194 billion, said George Miller, who led the research for the Altarum Institute, a nonprofit consulting group.

Legislation pushed by Senate Democrats mentions "prevention" repeatedly. The Senate panel heading up health reform also calls for more research on prevention, creates a new interagency council to coordinate a national health promotion strategy and permits insurers to give incentives for health promotion and disease prevention.
President Barack Obama as recently as April said investing in prevention "will save huge amounts of money in the long term." And it has become almost an article of faith among Republicans, Democrats and business leaders that prevention reduces health care costs.

But the Congressional Budget Office last week issued a statement on health care overhaul that dismissed the notion that prevention saves money. Prevention "would have clearer positive effects on health than on the federal budget," the CBO said.
The Partnership to Fight Chronic Disease wants the budget office to be more generous with its review of prevention, to take a longer time frame and to calculate savings to the private sector in lower absenteeism and higher productivity.

But researcher Peter Neumann of Tufts Medical Center said counting on disease prevention to save money "promises painless solutions to our health cost problems. I don't think they're going to be painless and they have to be done."

Supporters say each prevention effort should be held to the same standards as surgical techniques, drugs and medical devices, and not be expected to save dollars: Does it work and at a reasonable cost?

Prevention efforts with high value, although not cost-saving, include flu and pneumococcal shots for adults, Pap smears to screen for cervical cancer, colon cancer screening for people 50 and older, and screenings for vision problems, high blood pressure, high cholesterol and problem drinking.

Each of those things costs less than $35,000 per year of perfect health. Those strategies are a good place to start when money is limited, experts say.

"Some preventive services save money and some don't. Many of the services that don't save money improve people's lives at relatively low cost," said Robert Gould, president of the nonprofit Partnership for Prevention. "I think that's what the American public wants from health reform."​
 

mak2

Active member
I catagorize my YMCA membership as lesiure expenses. A very nice pair of running shoes is about $80.00 (you dont need this years model for a real runner). I have a $1500 dollar bike I ride to work daily saving gas and helping me lose weight. 450 round trips and I have paid for my bike at $2 per gallon.

I find the right wingers arguments against UHC humorous. Now its "prevention dont matter, personal trainers are too expensive."

Humana estimates these costs at the following for 2009:

- $19.39 in added health care costs for every overweight pound;
- $1,037.64 for every overweight individual;
- $127 billion added to the national health care bill.

Overweight people are more prone to heart disease, stroke, diabetes - even some kinds of cancers. Chronic diseases that are a result of weighing too much are an ever-increasing part of America's health care bill.

Yea, dont bother working out and losing weight. Have an open heart some day, Heart surgeons, hospitals and the rest of the healthcare system needs the money. That would be funny if not so sad.
 

mak2

Active member
Supporters say each prevention effort should be held to the same standards as surgical techniques, drugs and medical devices, and not be expected to save dollars: Does it work and at a reasonable cost?

So now my spinning class at the Y needs evidence based studies to ensure cost effectiveness. Wow.
Yep, I had to go back and read that article again. It really does imply worring about prevention just aint worth the money. What a hoot.
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
What I find is odd is that there seems to be NO MIDDLE GROUND.

It would be idiotic to say that being fit doesn't matter. But it is just as idiotic to claim that prevention is clearly effective. It is not a panacea that can fix everything, in fact it may only fix a modest percentage of things.

Me, I can't ride a bike to work, the round trip would likely take a very fit person the better part of a day.
 

mak2

Active member
"But it is just as idiotic to claim that prevention is clearly effective." Really? So prevention is not clearly effective? You serious?

I do agree everyone eventually dies of something, someone who has never smoked might die of lung cancer, a runner might die of heart disease. But behaviors do significantly impact a persons health.
 

Spiffy1

Huh?
SUPER Site Supporter
"But it is just as idiotic to claim that prevention is clearly effective." Really? So prevention is not clearly effective? You serious?

I do agree everyone eventually dies of something, someone who has never smoked might die of lung cancer, a runner might die of heart disease. But behaviors do significantly impact a persons health.

Not sure whether a slight tangent, or the point itself, but if healthcare ends up in the hands of DC, we'll never know or optimize the right ratio of prevention/cure.

Not saying the current system isn't screwed up, especially considering much of it somehow landed on the shoulders of employers - however, with competing private sources, the bottom line demands delivering the most cost effective ratio; with government, it depends on appeasing the right mix of people for the greatest chances for re-election of the greatest number of elected officials.

Oh, and don't forget government must be "fair", so the hillbilly up 100miles of twisting road into the mountains will have to have equal opportunity for prevention as the guy 2blocks from the Y. Or how about the neighborhoods more interested in supporting their crackhouse. We'd have to build a million new fitness centers, mostly for people who would not want them. :hammer:
 

mak2

Active member
Not sure whether a slight tangent, or the point itself, but if healthcare ends up in the hands of DC, we'll never know or optimize the right ratio of prevention/cure.

Not saying the current system isn't screwed up, especially considering much of it somehow landed on the shoulders of employers - however, with competing private sources, the bottom line demands delivering the most cost effective ratio; with government, it depends on appeasing the right mix of people for the greatest chances for re-election of the greatest number of elected officials.

Oh, and don't forget government must be "fair", so the hillbilly up 100miles of twisting road into the mountains will have to have equal opportunity for prevention as the guy 2blocks from the Y. Or how about the neighborhoods more interested in supporting their crackhouse. We'd have to build a million new fitness centers, mostly for people who would not want them. :hammer:


I am an RN. Some of the best research out there is from UHL countries. Recearch there is not concerned as much with profit as it is effectiveness. They call it evidnece based practice. Private sources really dont compete for patients, I dont remember how much I posted about it but my insurance company will pay about a million dollars for my wife this year. We had no choice where to go or what to do, the doctors just told us, the ambulance rides alone was $13k. I am thankful for my great insurance and how great the health care was (very high profit stuff). I had doctors, many of which I know personlly, when I asked them about a test or procedure jsut tell me not to worry about it, the insurance covers it. When she went to rehab they put her on the cardiac rehab program because the insurance would pay for it. The problem was nto cardiac but again the insurance paid more for cardiac. They are profit centered. It would have been a nightmare if we did not have great insurance. We are pretty well off but a million bucks would have forced us to declare bankruptcy.

Which brings me to the next point. Had we been poor, non paying people working at the burger doodle, we would ahve all paid by higher premiums and taxes, and the WT woudl not have gotten as good of care.

I have to go but prevention is one of my favorite topics. Ill be back.
 

XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq

Master of Distraction
Staff member
SUPER Site Supporter
Me, I can't ride a bike to work, the round trip would likely take a very fit person the better part of a day.

You are evil. You should be living in the densely packed city living under close government control.

Your desire to live in the country is clearly a threat to the greater good.

:whistling:
 

XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq

Master of Distraction
Staff member
SUPER Site Supporter
Mak - very few people are as active as you. You are not going to get your average lower income person to exercise no matter how much money you throw at them.

The end user has to be self motivated to participate in any sort of preventative program.

Evidence based care is just another re-branding of the practice of limiting the number of procedures that will be paid for because there is limited statistical evidence supporting their success rate. What this means is that your doctor may not be allowed to do a procedure because the government has done a study and determined that "statistically" the success rate for the procedure is low.

I think doctors will ultimately be fine with this because it removes their liability for not recommending procedures that may not be successful. As it stands now most doctors feel they have to offer everything to the patient or else the patient will sue them later.
 

jpr62902

Jeanclaude Spam Banhammer
SUPER Site Supporter
Recearch there is not concerned as much with profit as it is effectiveness.

But businesses are concerned with profit, without which, they could not survive. The article isn't saying that prevention isn't worth it. It's saying that the expense of prevention programs to businesses is rarely cost effective (i.e.: it doesn't prevent a greater amount of health related expense to the business).

It seems to me it isn't too hard to figure out why. If someone else is paying for it (it's "free") people don't take it as seriously. Now if there were a study on prevention expenses incurred directly by the consumer, employee, etc., I'd bet those prevention measures would be much more cost effective. But I'm just speculating ....

Edit: PB thinks and types faster than I do ......
 

mak2

Active member
Universal health care. Social Medicine. "Free" to some around here.

I actually agree that many will never get off the couch for anything excpet a trip to the fridge.

My grandfather used to eat slabs of bacon, er at least several pieces with bacon and eggs in lard etc. But then he would go out and chop a couple ricks of wood, milk the cows and throw a couple hundred bales of hay in the barn. One of the other has to go. more exercise or less intake or both. Lifestyles need to change. I read somewhere smoking rates are down to 20%. Not that I agree with how smokers are treated but the constant bombardment of people about how bad smoking has signifigantly reduced smoking rates. If america focused more on a healthy lifestyle, not really health clubs but jogging paths, stuff like that, average weight would decrease as would healthcare costs. There is a direct correlation between obesity and healthcare costs. I know some cant ride bikes to work, I was just using that as an example. Simple stuff can be worked into your day. stairs instead of the elevator, park at a distant space when you go to walmart.
 
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