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Best use of a snowcat?

1boringguy

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1boringguy

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PJL, I hadn't noticed that. I'll have to crop that pic a little differently and get all that in. :a1:
 

NorthernRedneck

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Lol. That brings back memories. I remember when my ex wife told me I couldn't go grooming because I had to watch the kids, I loaded them up and went anyway.

Canadian eh!!!
 

1boringguy

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Finally got to take the Patrol out for a spin. Couple little things (isn't there always?) but hopefully no big deals. First day made a loop about 14 miles alone, second day went about 19 miles farther up the mountain, with the crew. One herd of around 75 elk, and another of about 20, and one mangy coyote. Trinity mountains, west of Sun Valley, North of Soldier. Turned around at a dead fall across the road, running out of time anyway, maybe 7500 feet, (Trinity LO is 9900' ) about 21 inches of snow there.
 

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1boringguy

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how dose the truck do hauling both cats ? nice set up.

It works good, for me, but I remember when I was a kid we had a Pete with a 318 Detroit. Cabbage hill is 7 miles of 7%, and it took me 1 hour to get from the bottom to the top. Everything is an improvement from there right?

It's the 6.7, F350, drw, auto trans and grossing, I'm guessing about 32,000# this day, it still can maintain 50 on most hills, 70 freeway. Of course more weight is not your friend uphill or downhill on slick roads, but with some caution, experience, and chains if needed, it's ok. DRW are only good if you need that for weight, but having that on the tow rig makes it easier to opt for that on a trailer because your already cutting that track. I have to move both cats up to the front, fold the ramps up and then move the rear cat back to onto the ramps a bit to distribute weight correctly. Pump the air bags on the truck up to about 85 psi. and that levels it out pretty good.

It looked like you had about the same set up for hauling the Tin Cup Tucker, is it?
 

1boringguy

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Out getting a little more 'use' in today. Trekked about 14 miles up the mountain to the old mining town of Silver City in the Owyhee mountains. Think 1867. Wind in the Snake River basin was 20mph+ and 55 degrees. Wind on top 5mph and 37 degrees, beautiful day up there. Snow is settling fast though. Elevation around 6500 feet.
 

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1boringguy

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Back up to the Owyhees for the afternoon.
 

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1boringguy

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I think thar Patol is an awesome machine,but wonder if not having a blade has posed any problens?

I'm new enough at this that I haven't had a problem yet, but I suspect that there will be times. With the high altitude, bare wind blown summits/saddles found in the western U.S. causing steep side slopes, it's bound to come up I'm sure. On this machine the frame is built to take a blade but no hydraulics for it.

Pederson's in Utah said they have added blades to Troopers, used br blade and OEM engine driven pump, not to difficult. Or I might find a used blade and use a battery powered pump set up. I understand the hydraulics are slower with the battery pump set up and the engine driven pump takes some hp constantly. With the wide tracks, flotation seems pretty good so I don't know how much I need the blade for compaction as apposed to just cutting a side slope to a level track occasionally. Is my use ultimately 30% or 3% of the time.
Not sure but thinking a little more experience might help me decide.
 

olympicorange

Active member
.... I like your idea of the electric over hyd. ... Much easier to run wires...than mount a pump and so on. I work a lot on manlift s. They have such a setup...in case the engine dies. Nice to be able to get down in that scenario. I would suggest looking into one of those...say off a parts machine. Its a component that rarely gets used. Now if you get one off of an electric only unit...than that would have more hrs. Of useage... Also making the I.d. of hoses as large ..or larger ...than your smallest restriction helps with flow rates....
 

1boringguy

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OO,

Thanks, that's a great thought about a source for that type of setup. The Patrol is a 24v system, do the lifts tend to be 12v or 24v?
 

1boringguy

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On a strictly informational note. I still had both cats on the trailer yesterday so I drug them down to the local petrol bowser to fill and compare fuel consumption.

The Patrol is perkins turbo diesel, hydro drive. The Skidozer is the Ford I6 300 single barrel carb, three speed auto trans. I think the specs give top speed on both in the 20-21 mph range. We traveled up and down about 4,500 feet elevation and 25 miles on packed snow. Temp 25-28 degrees. Rpm of course varies up and down on the Skidozer, I'm running the Patrol at around 1,800 rpm. The Patrol took 9.4 gals, the Skidozer took 9.9 gals.
 

olympicorange

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OO,

Thanks, that's a great thought about a source for that type of setup. The Patrol is a 24v system, do the lifts tend to be 12v or 24v?

…….. most are 12v units,... a few, more rare, larger lifts had 24v option … not too common. but you can make that work , by hooking to one battery only. but you would have to ''isolate'' all electrical components involved to it , from being introduced to the rest of the machine . alittle more involved , but do-able . so basically running an isolated 12v circuit/system , separated/insulated/ rubberized mounts, etc...so on,...
 

1boringguy

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…….. most are 12v units,... a few, more rare, larger lifts had 24v option … not too common. but you can make that work , by hooking to one battery only. but you would have to ''isolate'' all electrical components involved to it , from being introduced to the rest of the machine . alittle more involved , but do-able . so basically running an isolated 12v circuit/system , separated/insulated/ rubberized mounts, etc...so on,...

Rubberized mounts?
I put a 12v elec winch on this cat. Ran 2/0 cables from the pos and neg of just one of the two batteries in series that make up the 24v. This is bad? Risks to the 24v electronics? The 12v winch? Charging system?
 

1boringguy

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To the hot springs for New Years ..... had to take the toy too.
 

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Cidertom

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re using 12 of 24 for winch. my 2 cents:


probably get away with it for low use. But... The current to charge the two batteries is in series. So, the power draw will deplete that battery. To get that battery back to full will eventually over charge the second battery. Yes, there are schemes to equalize the levels, but most are kinda 'rube goldberg' in application.



I've seen a separate 12 volt deep discharge battery used to power 12 volt loads (12 volt hydraulic power pack) that had a 24volt to 12 volt charge controller to recharge it. Don't know if it would do for a winch's draw.



Personal opinion is get a 24 volt motor or convert to 12 volt system. Warn and most of the real electric winch make 24 volt motor units that will swap for the 12 volt motor leaving the drive train as is.
 

1boringguy

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re using 12 of 24 for winch. my 2 cents:


probably get away with it for low use. But... The current to charge the two batteries is in series. So, the power draw will deplete that battery. To get that battery back to full will eventually over charge the second battery. Yes, there are schemes to equalize the levels, but most are kinda 'rube goldberg' in application.



I've seen a separate 12 volt deep discharge battery used to power 12 volt loads (12 volt hydraulic power pack) that had a 24volt to 12 volt charge controller to recharge it. Don't know if it would do for a winch's draw.



Personal opinion is get a 24 volt motor or convert to 12 volt system. Warn and most of the real electric winch make 24 volt motor units that will swap for the 12 volt motor leaving the drive train as is.

Yea I know the voltage imbalance of the batteries while charging is a bit tough on them. Considerd getting a 24v motor for the winch but then couldn't swap it back and forth to the Skidozer, it's 12v. I have a buddy that's had a 2000xl for four years and he's used the winch once. At that kind of duty cycle its probably not too detrimental to the batteries, but I'd hate to damage electronic components of the hydrostatic drive system. The machine has an inverter that creates 12v to run some accessories, radio, ect. and of course that unit couldn't run a winch, but there are 12v and 24v systems being used simultaneously on the cat anyway.

Still could get a high CCA battery and just charge it, like you say, from a 24v to 12v charger.
 

olympicorange

Active member
…. both great points fellas,... all to be considered, as on any task. somehow we went from ''blade'' to ''winch'', but regardless, both the same concept. voltage draw, load, etc. I wasn't going to bring in the ''electrical engineering'' aspect of discharge, keep it simple , but we all love the white elephant in the room. simply due that most of the time ; running a function on a blade is a ''shorter'' duration, than running a winch to pull trees, stuck rigs, etc. and the ''back-up'' hyd. units on these manlifts move some oil, they run a manlift almost as good as the main hyd. system itself. so an adequate rerservoir is key. moving oil is slightly easier than gears. ….how about adding another battery into the equation in ''parallel'' …. ''need more power scotty''... lots of options ….. :thumbup:
 

1boringguy

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…. both great points fellas,... all to be considered, as on any task. somehow we went from ''blade'' to ''winch'', but regardless, both the same concept. voltage draw, load, etc. I wasn't going to bring in the ''electrical engineering'' aspect of discharge, keep it simple , but we all love the white elejphant in the room. simply due that most of the time ; running a function on a blade is a ''shorter'' duration, than running a winch to pull trees, stuck rigs, etc. and the ''back-up'' hyd. units on these manlifts move some oil, they run a manlift almost as good as the main hyd. system itself. so an adequate rerservoir is key. moving oil is slightly easier than gears. ….how about adding another battery into the equation in ''parallel'' …. ''need more power scotty''... lots of options ….. :thumbup:

When you had mentioned rubber mounts (i thought as an electric insulating factor) with putting 12v hyd pump system on, I was just saying I had already added a 12v winch which of course isn't rubber mount. Just weren't sure if there might be a risk to the 24v hydrostatic drive control electronics by having the 12v not done properly. Same concern as along the lines of frying the electronics box by welding on the machine. The manual states that one should not only disconnect the electronic control box, but completely remove it from the machine to eliminate risk of damage while welding. So anyway I'm a little gun shy about what I might not be knowledgeable of in that regard. But again the machine comes with 24v and 12v systems for different purposes from the factory. But like a welder, a winch is moving a lot of electrons, as might an elec/hyd pump ......... so just asking if anyone has more knowledge of whether I should be concerned with what I've done with the winch in that regard.
 

olympicorange

Active member
….. ahh, ..that's very handy to have those options from the factory. always a good idea to remove the ecm's, etc.... when welding. also an old practice , before welding,.. disconnect the batteries, and main lead to the ALT. , as well... time well spent to save parts replacement,.....
 

olympicorange

Active member
here's a smaller version of a manlift electric pump and reservoir... that could be modified for your plow...etc..... and this one is 24volt ….
 

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olympicorange

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OO,

What's this one off of?

….. a JLG , manlift …. one of those scissor-lifts/manbasket . used to raise the manbasket straight up. it's a one cyl. design, operates very fast , could be adapted to add extra functions, with another block & solenoids,... etc...
 
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