Property taxes

Today is one of the two days a year here in Indiana that reminds me that no person in this country may privately own any property. Don't believe me? Just stop paying rent (taxes) on some property you think you own and see what happens.

Since private land ownership is supposedly one of the biggest rights and freedoms we have in this country, why is it that nobody is ever allowed to ever own any property?? I ask the government to set a price, pick a price, any price, and allow me to pay their damn tax once and be done so I can actually own some property. Private land ownership is the biggest farce I see in this country. The government owns all of the property in this country.

I'm sure some here likely pay far more than I do in property taxes, but I get hit for almost ten thousand dollars a year total for the properties I own. That bogus rent just makes my blood boil. I don't ever want to owe anyone anything. With property taxes, this is impossible. Anybody else see property taxes as making a mockery out of the great American Dream of private land ownership?

Dargo said:

Anybody else see property taxes as making a mockery out of the great American Dream of private land ownership?

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Yes - all taxes are evil.

I understand your pain. Try 25K per year. I am sure that there are people here that pay more than I do.

I do feel that property taxes are one of the more unfair taxes that there is. You work hard to own something and then they tax you on it.

Here fifty per cent of the property taxes goes to the schools. I think that they should have a kid tax that would pay for the schools. That would not work as it would put the tax on the users of the system and that is not democratic.

Real estate taxes has been my biggest gripe for many years.

REDDOGTWO said:

I understand your pain. Try 25K per year. I am sure that there are people here that pay more than I do.

I do feel that property taxes are one of the more unfair taxes that there is. You work hard to own something and then they tax you on it.

Here fifty per cent of the property taxes goes to the schools. I think that they should have a kid tax that would pay for the schools. That would not work as it would put the tax on the users of the system and that is not democratic.

Real estate taxes has been my biggest gripe for many years.

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Whoa! I knew there'd be others here who pay more than I, but your property rent (tax) bill is brutal! I have no problem having a "kid tax" to pay for schools. The problem is that it seems that the people having the most in their brood pay no taxes at all and are in fact paid by the government to increase the size of their brood! I have five kids who have attended public schools and one now in a private school. I feel that at about 10k a year, I pay my fair share for my kids schooling yet I don't get to deduct one cent from my taxes for all my expenses raising my kids because of how our tax code works. If I didn't work at all, I would get thousands and thousands from the government to help me with all my kids.

Which brings me to Obama, which I can't help. Last week my brother in law (the one I am good friends with) took Obama's challange and plugged our info into his site to see how much better off we'd be under his tax plan. Here is the joke of Obama's plan; I'd have to pay more taxes and my BIL would get an additional $3500 a year back in taxes. Oh, the reason it's a joke? Right now my BIL readily admits that he gets back almost $3000 a year more than he ever pays in taxes!!!

We only rent our land from the government, the property taxes are the rent payments.

If the government was serious about property rights then they would start by eliminating property taxes on the retired and eventually phase the age range down over time so that no age group pays property taxes. Of course, they'd end up having to replace those property taxes with other taxes, perhaps some sort of sales or consumption taxes.

B_Skurka said:

Of course, they'd end up having to replace those property taxes with other taxes, perhaps some sort of sales or consumption taxes.

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And, believe it or not, I'm fine with that. I'd rather pay more of a tax that doesn't make a mockery of our constitution and American Dream than to live in a country where one of our most sacred "rights" is a complete farce.

I have evolved to the point where I understand the innate necessity of taxes for us to enjoy many of the freedoms we enjoy. It is just when one of these taxes explicitly removes one of the fundamental freedoms we are to enjoy that my feathers get ruffled.

I also hate property taxes. And Ohio has more than it's fair share of taxes. But WV goes one step further. They have what is called a 'personal property' tax. So this means before you can renew your license plates you have to pay an annual tax on the estimated value of all your vehicles, boats, RTV's and anything else they can think of. And they have their standard 6% tax on groceries. Ohio has a way of getting the same percentage of tax from our pocket books but at lease we do not tax food items nor do they tax us yearly on our personal property.

Yep, I too hate property taxes. Mine run in the 5-figures as well. Grrr.

Dargo said:

plugged our info into his site to see how much better off we'd be under his tax plan.

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Who's site? I'd like to plug some numbers in myself.

As much as I hate the idea of a state income tax [none in SD], I'd glady vote for it if it guaranteed [absolutely positively, no return, guarantee - not there is a such thing] that the property tax would be abolished.

A perfect example, a bit related to Dargo's: the school board [fiscally correct decision, but based on the tax system quite wrong IMHO] decided that they'd rather spend 2 or 3 times the money for a new school than fix some major issues on the existing building and still have a questionable building. However, around here, farmers pay a large percentage of the property tax and have a small percentage of the school children - in fact many of the children in school in that town are from familys that work in the city [if at all in some cases] and don't contribute much [if at all] to the town community. The tax increase was voted down the first time, but after some cut-backs it was passed - soooo, the rural folk are getting socked almost as much extra tax to pay for a school with undersized classrooms filled with town kids.

I can however make exactly one case for property tax [partially to play devils advocate; in reality, like inheritance tax, I see many more situations where it works negative rather than positive]: it is an additional force for generations to somehow contribute value to their wealth or face the beauty of class mobility in reverse.

B_Skurka said:

We only rent our land from the government, the property taxes are the rent payments.

If the government was serious about property rights then they would start by eliminating property taxes on the retired and eventually phase the age range down over time so that no age group pays property taxes. Of course, they'd end up having to replace those property taxes with other taxes, perhaps some sort of sales or consumption taxes.

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Or the government could try and re-evaluate all the services it provides and find other "fair" methods paying for the services. Or just cut out all the unnecessary crap that they keep piling on.

Toll roads and other "usage" taxes are an idea.

As long as we keep being complacent about government bloat we will never reduce our tax burden.

bczoom said:

Yep, I too hate property taxes. Mine run in the 5-figures as well. Grrr.


Who's site? I'd like to plug some numbers in myself.

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Ha! I just looked it up in the "history" of my computer. It's changed!! The way it calculates, that is. What a surprise. I still won't get any tax break but my BIL's tax break (windfall) has been reduced by about 2/3 since BHO was elected. Creeps! Here is that site Barrys magical wonderful mystery wheel of taxes

Our county pays for schools through levies based on property taxes. My poor cousin has several properties and home schools all his kids.

I remember working at McDonald's when I was in high school and college and there was a woman (classic Obama supporter shall we say) and she would only work a few hours a day. She probably didn't make $10,000 a year but she would always get back like $5,000 in tax refund. Of course she had kid and let on to gov that she didn't know who the daddy was but got money from him under the table (less than what he would pay in child support) plus she got food stamps and gov housing. I asked her why she didn't work more hours and she said it would cut into her free money and cause her rent to go up. And wouldn't you know it, I just heard that her daughter just had a baby who she doesn't know who the daddy is, and the cycle continues.

Too true K-dog. Sure wish someone would figure out a way to break that cycle [actually it's easy: shut off the faucet, and put in some earplugs for a couple years until the whining stops.... local charity can much easier figure out who's deservant of a hand-up and who's looking for hand-outs], but I don't see it being Obama!

Sounds like everyone voted for the wrong party(s).

Libertarian Platform

2.1 Property and Contract

Property rights are entitled to the same protection as all other human rights. The owners of property have the full right to control, use, dispose of, or in any manner enjoy, their property without interference, until and unless the exercise of their control infringes the valid rights of others. We oppose all controls on wages, prices, rents, profits, production, and interest rates. We advocate the repeal of all laws banning or restricting the advertising of prices, products, or services. We oppose all violations of the right to private property, liberty of contract, and freedom of trade. The right to trade includes the right not to trade — for any reasons whatsoever. Where property, including land, has been taken from its rightful owners by the government or private action in violation of individual rights, we favor restitution to the rightful owners.

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