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Afghanistan War now officially longer than Viet Nam

RobsanX

Gods gift to common sense
SUPER Site Supporter
Still no Bin Laden. Is being there making us safer?

As of today, June 7, 2010, the war in Afghanistan has lasted 104 months, surpassing Vietnam as the longest war in American history. American forces invaded Afghanistan in October 2001, Kabul fell that November, and America’s attention shifted to the war in Iraq. It wasn’t until after the 2007 troop surge in Iraq and, after that, the 2008 election that America refocused its attention on Afghanistan, but our troops were there all along.
In December 2009, President Obama committed another 30,000 troops to the region. Critics and pundits have not been shy about comparing the conflict to the one in Vietnam, and Gordon Goldstein’s book Lessons in Disaster, about President Kennedy and Johnson’s national security decisions leading up to the Americanization of the Vietnam War, was circulated around the White House as they formulated their new strategy in Afghanistan. A touchstone of Obama’s Afghanistan strategy is the drawing down of troops come summer 2011. By that time, the war will be 116 months old—a record, we can only hope, that will remain in the books for many years to come.



http://www.vanityfair.com/online/da...istan-now-officially-longer-than-vietnam.html
 

Cowboy

Wait for it.
GOLD Site Supporter
I just seen something this morning that said they are pretty sure they know where bin ladin & some of the top leaders are at . I cant find it right now but suposedlly he is in some isolated city in Iran . I,ll look & see where I found it , not sure if it was a reliable sorce or not :smile:
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
Is being there making us safer?

Simply I don't know, but I tend to think the obvious answer would be YES.

But I have to ask. If we leave will we be safer?

And if we leave then does that mean we simply don't care about the deaths in the Pentagon? Or World Trade Center? Or the plane crash in PA?

If we leave does that send a message to terrorists that they can bomb us and we simply won't bother to fight after a set period of time?

These are questions I've never gotten a sufficient answer for.
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
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Heres the link , Not sure how credable the story is though . :wink:

http://www.debka.com/article/8841/

Regardless. My questions really need to be answered in a rational way before we pull out of Afghanistan. Those are really the core questions that need to be discussed simply because those are the heart of the reason we went into that nation.
 

Cowboy

Wait for it.
GOLD Site Supporter
Regardless. My questions really need to be answered in a rational way before we pull out of Afghanistan. Those are really the core questions that need to be discussed simply because those are the heart of the reason we went into that nation.


Personally even if Obama & his cohorts are in Iran & even if they are caught or killed , I dont think that has that much to do with wether or not we should pull out of Afghanistan or not . IMO its not like the rest of the terrorists are just going to surrender , so I dont think we are even close to where we should pull out anytime soon . Just my thoughts .
 

RobsanX

Gods gift to common sense
SUPER Site Supporter
Regardless. My questions really need to be answered in a rational way before we pull out of Afghanistan. Those are really the core questions that need to be discussed simply because those are the heart of the reason we went into that nation.

Is our presence just creating a conveyor belt of terrorists? They grow up hating us, join a terror group, we kill them. Lather, rinse, repeat. Unless we can look like the "good guys" to the local population, then anything we do will just breed more terrorists.
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
Is our presence just creating a conveyor belt of terrorists? They grow up hating us, join a terror group, we kill them. Lather, rinse, repeat. Unless we can look like the "good guys" to the local population, then anything we do will just breed more terrorists.

So what you are saying is that we should not have responded to the terror attack because it creates more terror?
 

Big Dog

Large Member
Staff member
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There is a resolution, we just won't pull the trigger on it ............ war is war and we just keep on making the same mistakes. The winner in a war can't be a nice guy all the time.
 

RobsanX

Gods gift to common sense
SUPER Site Supporter
So what you are saying is that we should not have responded to the terror attack because it creates more terror?

I do think that attacking Afghanistan and Iraq has bred more terrorists. Whether or not we should have done it depends on the justification.

I think it was appropriate to invade Afghanistan.
 

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
Rob, lets focus on Afghanistan. That is the title of your thread. Mixing the two wars is counter productive. The invasions of each were for very different reasons. Some, like myself consider one just and one unjust.

So back to your topic.

You claim that it was appropriate to invade Afghanistan. That being said, then are you agreeing that we should stay in because of what happened in NYC, Wash DC and PA? Are you now saying that we need to maintain our resolve so we don't show weakness which will further invite attacks? If we leave does that send a message to terrorists that they can bomb us and we simply won't bother to fight?


I'm very confused about what messages you are conveying.
 

SShepherd

New member
we're simply delaying another attack in our country.

Terrorists know our govt. is soft- they know we won't do what needs to be done to eridicate the problem, they've said so themselves.
 

RobsanX

Gods gift to common sense
SUPER Site Supporter
Should we stay in because of 9/11? We already have the mastermind of that attack. So unless we are actively pursuing Bin Laden, then I don't see why we are still there.
 

Big Dog

Large Member
Staff member
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Should we stay in because of 9/11? We already have the mastermind of that attack. So unless we are actively pursuing Bin Laden, then I don't see why we are still there.

Yep, but who's idea was it to attack us on our soil? There is a difference between the killer and the accomplice! The master mind IMO was the accomplice.
 

BigAl

Gone But Not Forgotten
SUPER Site Supporter
I am going to hate myself for jumping in on this .

We should have gone after Bin Laden first and taken care of bussiness BEFORE we headed to Iraq. I am not even sure we should have ever been in Iraq in the first place .:unsure: Bush Jr just had a real hard on for the guy , and it was about the oil ,weather most believe it or not .

A bigger question for me is why did we let the Saudi's walk away unscratched and they were the ones who financed 911 ??? Oh yea .... they have oil and we need it ......:glare:

They( terrorist) want their right to do whatever ???? Fine ! Then lets pull back , secure our borders , Stop the flow of aid money leaving the U.S.
and kick the holy shit out of any SOB that crosses our line . Hell , the people we are trying to help over there would spit on us , given the chance .


Oh Man .... I need another cup of coffee :unsure:
 

muleman

Gone But Not Forgotten
GOLD Site Supporter
The muslims have vowed to kill us and take over our country by any means they can use. We are better off fighting them over there than here. Those who feel we should pull out would change their minds fast if the attacks were going on here. The one fatal error we are making is not securing our borders. They will attack us again in America but we can hope to lessen the damage and work to eradicating them where they base their forces from. I see our forces deployed for the long haul and not just in Afghanistan.
 

loboloco

Well-known member
Afghanistan and Irag both were part of a bastion and glacis concept of global war. Basically, you get the enemy to fight on their territory and create 'fortress' nations in their AOR. So far, this has been most successful in Iraq, mainly because the Afghanis are at heart, hillbillies with a really bad attitude.

Because of the Glacis concept, we should not leave Afghanistan. Our presence in these countries has not bred more terrorists, but focused their attention on something other than us.
 

Doc

Bottoms Up
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
Our presence there has moved many of the terrorists to Yemen or Iran or some other country. We had a good reason to go but there is no end in sight. No resolution means we will stay until it bankrupts our nation. We've already spent over 1 trillion on both wars. We are headed to the crapper if we continue to throw money at the problem without truly fighting it as a war.
 

mak2

Active member
I have not said a lot about the wars but what the heck. I dont beleive in war. I think war should be our very, very last choice when we have tried everything else. But when an issues arises that is important enough to the security of this country we have to go to war, when the first round comes down range, all the stops should be pulled out. The generals should be cut loose and the troops should have every available killing apparatus in the world to do their job. If we adopted this attitude there might be one more war. In that war the US would roll over some little country and blast it back to the stone age. Then take it over and make it a trading partner like Japan. Just keep little reminders what happens if you mess with the US, like a flattened city or two or something. This 13 year war stuff is stupid.
 

Big Dog

Large Member
Staff member
GOLD Site Supporter
I have not said a lot about the wars but what the heck. I dont beleive in war. I think war should be our very, very last choice when we have tried everything else. But when an issues arises that is important enough to the security of this country we have to go to war, when the first round comes down range, all the stops should be pulled out. The generals should be cut loose and the troops should have every available killing apparatus in the world to do their job. If we adopted this attitude there might be one more war. In that war the US would roll over some little country and blast it back to the stone age. Then take it over and make it a trading partner like Japan. Just keep little reminders what happens if you mess with the US, like a flattened city or two or something. This 13 year war stuff is stupid.

Bravo ................ :clap:
 

joec

New member
GOLD Site Supporter
I agree with you comments Mak 100%. If I had a say Afghanistan wouldn't support life for another century at least but would a good source for black glass. Never should of put a single man on the ground their as every occupying army has fail there regardless. It is a place where nations go to die and has been for centuries.

As for Iraq I agree with Al on that one for sure. As for terrorist the best solution was the Israeli way. Hunt them down and take them all out. We have lost more lives that 911 and never mind those that will carry injuries for the rest of their lives many of which didn't get a viewable scratch.
 

waybomb

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
Just a point of reference:
 

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RedRocker

Active member
Islamo Fascists have been attacking us for decades with little or no response from any President up until Dubya. Just like a school yard bully, our lack of response and our turn tail and run policy led up to the death of three thousand Americans on 9-11. Had Reagan decimated the responsible parties that killed our Marines in Beirut we might have avoided decades of this crap. I've got news for you that believe our response "breeds" more terrorists. They were born to hate infidels and they feed on weakness, the only response should be swift and brutal decimation. The message should be crystal clear, "DO NOT FUCK WITH THE USA!".
 

joec

New member
GOLD Site Supporter
Islamo Fascists have been attacking us for decades with little or no response from any President up until Dubya. Just like a school yard bully, our lack of response and our turn tail and run policy led up to the death of three thousand Americans on 9-11. Had Reagan decimated the responsible parties that killed our Marines in Beirut we might have avoided decades of this crap. I've got news for you that believe our response "breeds" more terrorists. They were born to hate infidels and they feed on weakness, the only response should be swift and brutal decimation. The message should be crystal clear, "DO NOT FUCK WITH THE USA!".

You know for once RR I totally agree with you on this. Terrorist understand terrorism and nothing says it better than the might of this country raining down on their heads. The survivors would think twice about trying it again.
 

waybomb

Well-known member
GOLD Site Supporter
Where is the new Chinese Carrier?


In their dreams?

Varyag? It's just a hull, and stripped of its past Russian military equipment, including no propulsion.

Or are you thinking of the building that highly resembles a Nimitz class? It's not a ship. It's a building.
 

Tractors4u

Active member
Site Supporter
Is our presence just creating a conveyor belt of terrorists? They grow up hating us, join a terror group, we kill them. Lather, rinse, repeat. Unless we can look like the "good guys" to the local population, then anything we do will just breed more terrorists.


I'm a little late on this, but I wanted to comment on this post. You said something about looking like good guys to the locals. This is what we are attempting in Afghanistan and Iraq. The tactic is referred to as COIN, short for counter insurgency. It's all about wining the hearts and minds. It is obviously having some sort of impact. A "new rules for Taliban members" was recently interpreted and I saw it last week here at Ft Leonard Wood Missouri. I don't remember everything it said, but there were some like;

No more executions by beheading.
No more video taping of executions.
Members of the Taliban will not smoke.

While this is a good sign, the savages did hang a 7 year old boy last week.
 
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